Dec 29 2014 11:30am

Lost Girl 5x04 SPOILER THREAD: Keeping it in the Faemily

Lost Girl 5x04

Note: This post contains spoilers of all aired episodes of Lost Girl, including Friday night's Season 5, Episode 4, “When God Opens a Window.”

Tonight on Lost Girl—Dyson’s a daddy?!

Bo and Tamsin are still working out the kinks in their roommate agreement. For example, Bo expects when Tamsin says she’s coming back with weapons, she doesn’t mean stopping to bang a hottie in Bo’s bed. And Tamsin would like Bo to stop cock-blocking her when they’re shaking down a potential client turned suspect as it undermines the bad cop spiel she’s perfected over the centuries. Still, it’s nice to see they’re learning to share things like Chinese food and one-night stands…

Their Fae-of-the-Week is another hottie, Mark, who’s been hunted all his life by the same guy. He’s charming and sly and, as Bo puts it, a bit of a scoundrel, but his Lost Boy sincerity snags Bo right in the feels. Not like that. OK, a little like that since she’s inexplicably drawn to Mark. But more she relates to his story of not knowing who he is or why wherever he goes, he leaves a trail of bodies behind. Tamsin is strongly against helping Mark and even more strongly against trusting him, but Bo insists. Despite several bad starts, including one that leaves Bo with a crossbow bolt through her shoulder, Bo refuses to give up on Mark. She also is having trouble healing the crossbow wound, despite Tamsin happily macking with Bo for healing purposes, one session of which is interrupted by Doctor Lauren’s arrival. Hang on, did the doc just catch Tamsin and Bo making out? It really is Christmas! Possibly one of the most satisfying moments for me in the history of Lost Girl, I won’t lie, followed closely by Bo’s dismissive description of Doctor Lauren as her ex. Sigh. If only I could believe it would last.

The doc removes a parasite from Bo’s shoulder which she giddily explains is a mineral and it’s alive. The parasite splits every time Bo tried to heal which reopened her wound. It also serves as a tracker, since where one parasite goes, another wants to follow. Bo: “Oh, I might hurl.” Doctor Lauren: “I know. I’m excited too.” Snort. Man, this hunter doesn’t mess around. Also, Doctor Lauren is starting to freak me out with her levels of glee in creepy things that hurt the Fae. When the hunter tracks Mark to Hilton Hovel, the doc hits him with a tranq gun that she turns on Mark when he tries to kill the unconscious hunter. Doctor Lauren: “Maybe I shouldn’t be the one to hold the gun.” Heh. She got a lot of good lines tonight and Zoie Palmer had a blast delivering them.

At the clinic, Bo is so distracted by the hunter and her mysterious pull toward Mark, she barely takes heed of the doc geeking out over the carbon dating of the hunter’s impressive knife. Bo interrogates the hunter who insists that Mark killed his wife and family before his eyes and his murder of Mark’s mother and endless hunt of Mark is merely justified retaliation. Bo uses the succubus touch to see the hunter is telling the truth. Back at Hilton Hovel, she confronts Mark about the hunter’s story. He admits he did attack the man before but adds that his six-year-old self watched, hidden, while the hunter murdered Mark’s mother. Mark thinks he’s a coward for hiding while his mother was killed and for running from the hunter all his life. Bo gives into the mysterious draw she feels for Mark and they bang.

Lauren and the Morrigan 5x04An exceedingly chipper Doctor Lauren visits Evony at her new palatial home, probably in high spirits because she believes she has Evony by the mane of the righteous horse she rides in on. “Images of Catharine the Great,” the doc quips. See? Best lines. Stripped of her Fae powers against her will by the self-same Doctor Lauren, which nobody seems particularly put out about, Evony has had to resort to marrying an old, gout-infested sugar daddy to keep her in the style to which she’s become accustomed. Never mind that Evony has been a successful agent and power broker for entertainment talent for, oh, say, centuries and thus has amassed a fortune and career of her own. The minute she’s de-Faed, she needs to marry a man to support her. This is a woman-power show, right?

Doctor Lauren is there to get Evony’s approval on the new security system that will hopefully prevent things like the doc’s assistant getting murdered from happening again. So we have confirmation that Evony is funding the clinic that’s named after her with the agreement that Doctor Lauren will use it to develop a serum to re-Fae The former Morrigan. I don’t, for a second, believe the doc didn’t already make up the serum before she deployed her Magical Vag of Defaeing. But Evony is playing along for now. She’s even making an effort to engage the doc in some Ladies Who Lunch chat, but just because she’s human doesn’t mean Evony plays human any better. Doctor Lauren smugly tells her they can’t rush science.

While out the back door of The Dal, Trick nearly gets mugged saved only by the last-minute return of Vex. Vex is in da house! The two head over to Dyson’s gym where, naturally, Dyson’s first move is to try to kill Vex. Trick talks him down; he actually wants Dyson to work with Vex on a case of three dead humans found just outside of the Light Fae’s territory. He’s confident Dyson is the one man who will kill Vex if it turns out he’s lying again and suggests Dyson might need a Mesmer on this case anyway. Dyson reminds Trick that he’s sworn fealty to Bo and no longer serves Trick. Trick counters that it’s a good thing he’s acting Ash then, implying that as such, Dyson still has to do as he orders. I don’t know how a shifter whose sworn allegiance to the Unaligned Succubus is still beholden to obey the Light Fae Ash when she doesn’t, but whatever. I’m so glad to see them dicing over Fae politics again, I don’t even care. Trick reminds Dyson that, in the end, Dyson serves his own conscience and always has.

Dyson still wants to kill Vex and they have a bitter throw down over Vex’s responsibility for Hale’s death and Kenzi’s sacrifice due to his relationship with and protection of Massimo. Vex argues that he raised Massimo and it didn’t matter how bad the man got, Vex would always protect him. Dyson is unappeased and vows to kill Vex the next time he sees him.

Dyson heads for the clinic to review the files with the doc. There, he smells something he can’t identify, but the doc reminds him that at the clinic, there are a lot of bad smells. Vex unwisely follows Dyson and, in a near mindless rage, Dyson nearly shoots Vex’s head off. The fact that he draws his gun on Vex rather than wolfing out seriously freaks out both the Mesmer and the doc. Dyson is not dicking around. He snarls at Vex about how difficult it is to always make the right choice when he’d much rather give in and do what feels right instead. A frantic Doctor Lauren talks him down by insisting that Hale’s death was no one’s fault. Turns out, Dyson holds himself most responsible as he was the one who let Massimo go since it was the right thing to do. He reluctantly releases Vex and holsters his weapon.

All three of the human bodies were killed in related fashions and bear the same mark. Dyson, Vex, and Doctor Lauren put together that the humans are being ritually sacrificed by some kind of Fae cult. Dyson realizes the three bodies from the elevator crash that were stolen from the clinic after Doctor Lauren’s assistant was murdered are likely meant to be the next sacrifices. He gets a scent marker from the clothes of the resurrected blonde who killed the assistant last week. He and Vex head off to her apartment, but Bo’s call interrupts them before they can knock. She tells Dyson that Mark has gone off again to kill the hunter. Dyson realizes Mark is who he smelled at the clinic. He and Vex hurry off right before the blonde opens the door. Back inside the room, she asks her husband to refill her glass only to laugh that she has to do it herself. The camera pans over to show her husband’s been killed and electricity sparks across his blood-filled eyes.

At the clinic, Dyson rushes in right before Mark kills the hunter whom Dyson recognizes as Killian, a Fae who has hunted the Fae for centuries. Dyson reminds Killian that Light Fae law prohibits the hunting of shifters, especially those who haven’t changed yet, like Mark. Mark is shocked to learn he’s a shifter. Killian admits that since the Una Mens were killed off, he thought all the rules were null and void and it was open season on shifters again. Back in full hero form, Dyson talks Mark off the ledge by reminding him it’s always hardest to do the right thing. He helps Mark release Killian and orders the hunter to leave the territory.

Back at the Dal, Bo watches as Mark and Dyson mirror each other’s moves as they eat at opposite ends of the table. She finally clues in what Dyson’s sniffer figured out the moment he met Mark: Mark is Dyson’s son. Ruh roh. Mark, predictably freaks out. Dyson pleads that he didn’t know Mark’s mother was pregnant and vows never to let Mark down again. But Mark isn’t buying it. Having gone this long without family, he’s happy to keep on as is and stalks out of The Dal. Later, a morose Dyson draws out Killian. He agrees to let Killian kill him if Killian agrees to drop his hunt of Mark. Killian gloats that knowing Mark is Dyson’s son will just make killing him all the sweeter. This is how Dyson suspected Killian who answer. He signals for Vex who freezes Killian in place and makes him drop his knife. Dyson lets his wolf reign and relishes the feeling of doing what feels right instead of what is right for a change. While Vex looks on, Dyson wolfs out and kills Killian. It’s filmed in the reflection of a puddle, which is seriously cool.

Evony arrives at the clinic in full emotional distress. Being human is hard! She tried to be Doctor Lauren’s gal pal, but that got her nowhere so now she’s demanding the doc produce the re-Faeing serum, STAT. Doctor Lauren continues to patronize Evony. She claims to have had some setbacks in creating the serum. But Evony is done playing nice. She has her guards roll in a refrigerated box that cages the creature most feared by the Fae, one so old, it doesn’t even have a name. Evony has decided to store in it the clinic as incentive for the doc to get her ass moving on the re-Faeing serum. This successfully wipes the smugness right out of the doc as Evony leaves her holding the bag or, in this case, the cord.

Back at The Dal, Bo deals with her far share of horror over the fact that she banged Dyson’s son, albeit unknowingly. Well, that’s certainly keeping it in the Faemily. She realizes she sensed Mark’s familial connection to Dyson and it was that which made her feel so drawn to the kid. So basically, she banged Mark because he subconsciously reminded her of Dyson. I can go with that…with a little effort.

Bo orders Tamsin never to tell Dyson Bo slept with Mark. Yeah, like that’s not gonna come out with some nasty consequences later on, just you watch. After some teasing, Tamsin agrees. Bo muses that she once thought she and Dyson would….and Tamsin suggests Dyson once thought the same thing. “You guys are good together. Even if only as friends.” What’s all this “once” and “just friends” bullshit? More like always, show or have you already forgotten that declaration from last week? Though they do say your mate is your best friend…

Bo finds Dyson at the gym, still bloodied with the remains of Killian and nursing a mostly-empty bottle of whiskey. He stares at a picture of Piper, Mark’s mother, and tells Bo he’d heard Piper had died but never that she’d been pregnant. Bo tries to comfort him. “I love you Bo, I do,” Dyson says (See?!). “But I think I’d just like to be alone now.” Bo smiles sadly then hugs him tight and kisses him on the cheek. Before she leaves, Dyson thanks her for “looking out for my boy.” He tries to lighten the mood by telling her Mark likes her and could probably use a big sister right now, which makes Bo smile painfully. Maybe less Flowers in the Attic kind of big sister next time and more Eight Is Enough, ‘kay?

After Bo leaves, Dyson returns to his study of the case files from the sacrificed humans. Frowning, he shifts the crime scene photos around so the brands on each body line up to form one interlocking symbol. After he turns away, the symbol glows, not unlike the glowing handprint on Bo’s chest. The glow intensifies until the symbol burns black. Outside, lightening cracks across the sky.


This is the first episode of the new season that I truly enjoyed. Those scenes between Dyson and Vex really brought out some emotional stakes. I didn’t even mind it being Doctor Lauren who talked Dyson back from the edge. It’s really, really good to see characters actually talking about what happened last season rather than ignoring it or worse retconning plot and character to suit a new showrunner’s agenda direction. And I’m not sure yet, but I think I’m really gonna like this direction of Dyson questioning the honorable code he’s always lived by now that following it has led to such horrible consequences. Hearing Vex rail about all he would have and did do on Massimo’s behalf no matter how bad the druid got because he was Vex’s son obviously foreshadows the depths Dyson is about to go on behalf of Mark. For wolf boy’s sake, I hope he’s worth it. It better not cost Dyson his life.

Yeesh, when the cast and crew teased that season 5 was all about family for Bo, they really meant it, didn’t they? First she bangs her stepmother and now Dyson’s son? Yeah, she didn’t know the identity of either before she jumped them, but still. Fifty Shades of Ewwww. I like how Bo and Tamsin are feeling their way through this new partnership though the sharing of boy toys is…interesting. If there’s a three-way in the cards for S5, seems most likely it’ll originate with these two. And while Bo didn’t invite Tamsin to help with her healing, she didn’t push her off either, even with the doc there, which is also interesting. I’m working on a theory that the blonde from the elevator has been possessed by Bo’s Daddy, aka Hades, whose cult of Fae is sacrificing humans to increase his power on earth. Wasn’t that interlocking symbol on the tapestries in the Dark Horse S4 finale? Also, having Bo confronted with a young person who seems to be at the same place Bo was when the show first started is a lovely bookend for the show in this last season. I’m looking forward to seeing if it continues to play out. I can’t remember the last time I looked forward to anything in Lost Girl, though that’ll probably change next episode as per usual.

Finally, once again Doctor Lauren is skating on her heinous actions against another Fae. Quelle surprise. This time she’s even profiting from it as she’s somehow convinced Evony to fund her every desire for the clinic. I gave Evony a lot more credit than that, whether she’s Fae or not. That said, Zoie Palmer is channeling her own sense of humor into Doctor Lauren left and right and having a blast doing it, which I have to admit makes the doc more palatable than she’s ever been in the whole series. I had a good snort over the deliciously Meta throwaway “I’m the only one who finds me funny” line. Not moaning over Bo is working wonders for her. She’s demonstrably more confident too, though how much of that derives from the power she feels she has over Evony remains to be seen. It certainly looked like her bubble had been popped a bit at the end there. I still want Doctor Lauren to turn out to be the Big Bad against the Fae and eventually die a horrible death (what?!), but meanwhile, this was overall a vast improvement over the usual Doctor Magical Wonder Lauren status quo.

What did you think? Sound off in the comments.


Kiersten Hallie Krum writes smart, sharp & sexy romantic suspense. Find her snarking her way across social media as @kierstenkrum and on her web site and blog at

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1. nypinta
I'm confused on one point. Vex claims that Dyson let Massimo go, in essence blaming him for what happened. But Dyson didn't. Vex did. Dyson just didn't not kill Massimo when Kenzi wanted him too and took him to Trick instead. So why is Vex trying to lay that on Dyson? Because of this, I've decided that when Dyson tells the hunter that he once let a killer go and it was a mistake, he's really referring to Vex, not Massimo. (Because he did just that in Vexed when Bo confronted Vex at his club and Dyson kept Bo from killing him.)
Susan White
2. whiskeywhite
Thanks for the very helpful mini-recap, Kiersten. You don't need to invite us to sound off. Fend us off is more like it.

Before I go any further, I want to take back what I said about Lauren appearing disgusted at Dyson's naked chest when she went to him for training. I watched the episode again -- her request that he put his shirt on is clearly that -- a request, not an order -- and a rather tentative one at that. Clearly me making assumptions, which is bad. If it was intended as a joke though (which presumably it was), she didn't play it very strongly as such.

On to this week. I, too, enjoyed this episode. The first so far this season. The big feature for me was Dyson learning that he has a son (I presume that Mark will be a core character now, unless something goes terribly wrong). The most touching scene for me was Dyson holding Mark in his arms as he struggles to prevent him from attacking the hunter. How their relationship develops will be a major attraction for me to watch (I hope we get to see that).

Bo having sex with Mark also struck me as Ewwww. Not because of the sex itself (I, unlike others, had no problem with Bo having healing sex with an obviously delighted pizza boy way back in Season 2). What bothered me was the obvious emotional attraction she had to Mark -- THAT felt like cradle robbing.

At the same time, I don't like Bo planning to keep the encounter secret from Dyson forever (whatever happened to "no secrets" -- 1.12? I know, I know. Dyson kept his own secret -- but not out of self interest). Granted, it would take a sensitive discussion between Bo and Dyson -- at which this show is notoriously bad. But I think he would understand. Besides, is Mark not going to rather quickly find out about Bo and Dyson's history? Why would he keep it secret? In fact, he could use it to hurt his father against whom he has lots of resentment.
3. Nypinta
Yeah, that's going to be an interesting conversation. Besides, pretty sure it'll be Mark that spills the beans. I'm not sure what they were intending with Bo's near instant attraction. Was it supposed to just be because he's so much like Dyson? Or was it just her sympathetically responding to his plight being nearly identicle to her own? Then add in the sameness with Kenzi: age & being a con artist. What does it all mean!?! ;)
Susan White
4. whiskeywhite
Interesting suggestion, @nypinta, about Kenzi. But it seems clear that Bo was attracted to Mark's connection to Dyson -- she says, "that's why he seemed so familiar". You would hope though, that for the very reasons you say, she would stop for a minte and think about his vulnerability. However, as many have pointed out, Bo often thinks mostly about Bo. To be fair, in her world sex usually makes things better.

Speaking of that, it was interesting that when Bo came to comfort Dyson, he said that he would rather be alone that night. It was touching that he was almost apologetic: "If that's OK", as if he feels a duty to be always there for Bo regardless of his own needs.

I too liked the evolving relationship between Bo and Tamsin as they learn to work, and play, together. (For a supposedly bi-sexual woman, Tamsin sure spends a lot of time chasing men and their "sausages".) Again in this episode we see that sex with Bo for Tamsin is always about healing, although Tamsin is willing and at times quite tender. I agree that a threesome might be a (welcome) possibility.

The many benefits of re-watching included noticing that among the clothing that Mark chooses from Bo's "rack of men's clothes" (huh?) is the t-shirt with Hale's picture on it from the (darts?) tournament. This is the one that Dyson had to battle Ciara to keep, although his was white and Mark's is grey (presumably to make a more subtle point). A very sweet small touch.

I liked very much that they have dialled back on Wonder Lauren (not that I ever minded her being strong but Lauren Warrior Princess was too much on top of Lauren super scientist, the latter being plenty for me). I appreciated that she reacted with alarm at Dyson throwing punches in her training session but then was willing to open fire with the 'flying hypodermic' and her tranquilizer gun (loved: "I was President of PETA in high school").
5. nypinta
Mostly I'm just playing. But I do find it funny that Mark is like a weird blend of all three characters. He's Dyson, Bo, and Kenzi. That's just so odd & funny to me!

Which brings me to one quibble I have with the episode: As much as I did love Mark and Dyson and how they interacted and what we got to see in Dyson discovering this child he did not know about... I don't really like the randomness of Mark, (even though they did make him releveant to the team by giving him the tragic backstory that mirrored Bo's in so many ways was well as making him Kenzi aged and street smart), via a former flame that for some reason never bothered to tell Dyson about him. It feels both a bit soap opera and reminded me how sometimes on shows TPTB add a kid or a puppy to renew interest (and usually it's not done well) and this time they did both. (Ha. I kill me.) (Kenzi would be proud.) But, they could have still added a Mark character but *not* have had him be blood related to Dyson but still have created an almost instant paternal instinct in Dyson while using past characters already introduced to do so. For instance, Ciara was married to a shifter once and then quite suddenly had to marry a King. (I still am not fond of her particular back story, there being just a few too many fellas doing so much to win her affections but it exists so....) It could have been interesting if Mark was her and Stefan's son who came to town because he blames Dyson for his mother's death and wants to confront him or because he's there to find Cayden who made the mistake of coming back because it was Cayden that killed the King, his stepfather. That way they could parallel Dyson's feelings of responsibility and be a stand in father for Mark the way Vex was for Massimo, and have Dyson resolve the guilt I'm sure he carries about Ciara still (as well as Stefan), which would give Dyson something more to do without also having "dead beat dad" implied as part of his character. I know Piper didn't tell Dyson so it's not his fault, but some can take that to mean she didn't think he was good enough to know and I don't like that one bit. Or Mark could have been related to Angel, the shifter we saw in Dyson's memory, and he takes an immediate protective interest in him because of his feelings of affection for her. (I still wish we could have met the real Angel, BTW.) That way when Bo had her insta-attraction it wouldn't be with a son of a former (and current!) lover. Because that's also very soap opera. Plus, he wouldn't have to be a newbie and could have been whatever age they wanted. It was a mistake they made in S1, IMO, with Conal and Will of the Wisp. The actor they hired to play Will should have been as young looking as Conal, because he's fae and quite frankly didn't look like someone a stranded human would fall for in just one night (sorry guy who played Will). But it's like it was automatic that when they casting for a man to play the father of a 25+ something man they just looked at 50 something aged men. Same thing seems to have been in play here. Dyson looks (like a hella hot) 40 year old man, so they gotta get an actor nearly half his age. I know it's a ramble and mostly just me being a crank, but there you go. If they insisted on a son, he didn't have to be so new either. Because although I get that Bo is supposed to only be 30-33, it still felt a bit Cordelia/Connor to me.

Other stuff: loved how casually cruel Evony still is. I do wonder what she left with Lauren. Part of me thinks it's a bluff. But maybe not. Their scenes were fun. Although what is up with the humans=emotional thing? Are they finally admitting that fae are emotionally cut off and that is perhaps why they have so little empathy for other creatures usually while fae like Dyson, Hale, and Bo are anomolies? Or was that just Evony being Evony? But I'm pretty sure Lauren is using the serum as leverage to fund the clinic. It's the only reason Evony would fund her with no questions asked, other than "where is my goddamn serum!?" But Evony is not going to be played so easily. Hence her "gift". But as soon as Lauren cures her, unless Lauren figures out something else to use as leverage, Evony is totally going to enjoy melting her. At least they didn't Chipped Spike Evony and make her reliant on the team to survive. Even not being fae Evony comes out on top. Ha!

The blonde evil woman: does she look like Felicia Day to anyone else? A blonde Felicia Day? Not a complaint. It just struck me. I do wonder what she is up too and I've been too lazy to google the symbol Dyson discovered.

And I think something is wrong with me that one of my favorite parts of the episode was listening to Vex wax poetic about Dyson's nose. I think it was the way he said "aquiline". It was endelssly amusing. But I'm still with Dyson on being angry with him. No Hale wasn't Vex's fault. But Vex let Massimo go after and that gave him the opportunity to go after Lauren which gave Kenzi the time to do her thing.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
6. Kiersten
Wow, it really *is* a Cordelia/Connor thing! Remember, Mark hasn't had his first shift and shifter choose their animal, so he may not decide to be a wolf (tho I suspect for story reasons he will). Also, until a shifter has his first shift, he/she ages like a human, which is how Dyson was able to pinpoint who Mark's mother judging by his visible age because he is actually 19, not a several hundred years old shifter who looks 19.

That *is* in fact Hale's shirt. Bo implies it and in Showcase "enhanced" version of the ep on their website, a pop-up confirms it. When Bo said she had a rack of men's clothes, I figured they were from her various lovers/one-night stands and I think that was the point. Which makes it even more appropo to the ep that Mark picked of all things something that was immediately definable as belonging to Dyson. Also, I think it's clear that Bo's affinity toward Mark was definitely due to how his story parallels hers and Kenzi's but her attraction to him was definitely a reflection of her attraction to Dyson. She can't resist him not because of Mark but because of the Dyson connection. If she continues to bang him (and while I don't think she will, I'm not putting anything past this show) when she can have Dyson pretty much whenever she wants him, then it'll make things seriously weird b/c it'll be about Mark not his Dyson echo.

But yeah, when Dyson finds out, it's gonna be messy.

Vex did call Dyson's nose aquiline along with sharp, smooth, and slender. It cracked me up. I wonder if PRA was adlibbing for the laugh and to try and rattled KHR.

Yeah, think DL knows the moment she re-Faes Evony she's a goner. And I dont know about the emotions thing regarding Fae, it's clear Trick and nearly all of Bo's clients have emotions. I think that's just an Evony special and, more likely, something the writers failed to think all the way through when they went for the laugh. Hey, they're still recovering from S3&4. They won't get it *all* right, right away.
7. drusilla_doll
This is actually the first episode I've felt like rewatching. For me, it was the best of the season so far. Perhaps because it felt that there were interesting storylines for everyone. It wasn't only revolving around Bo & her (often romance related) problems. Instead we had an ensemble piece where every main member of the cast & even the guest stars had at least one decent scene.

We have the main plot moving forward with Dyson, Vex & Lauren trying to figure out what Fae cult is behind the sacrificial murders. They certainly got so close to meeting the current 'Big Bad' didn't they? The use of what I presume to be a triskelion symbol is interesting. It's also quite popular in genre shows - for example in Teen Wolf. I'm pondering what the symbol signifies in the greater context of the show. One idea which intrigues me is that of the three planes of existence - underworld (Hades/Tartarus), material world (earth), celestial world (heaven/valhalla). What if the cult wants to merge them all into one and thus gain dominion that way?

We have Lauren engaging in negotiations with Evony; utilising her wits & intelligence to try to stave off the inevitable revenge Evony surely has in store for her once she's fae again. I think Zoie is a funny actress and she really seemed to be enjoying the quippy dialogue. DL had more personality than I'd seen in her for a long while. I really liked that she was the one who talked Dyson down too.

Apart from the hokiness of having Mark just randomly find Bo's place to hide, I liked the introduction of the character & the actor playing him. I felt he did a much better job of reminding Bo of her roots & triggering her protective instincts than the Rainier debacle last season ever did. This made much more sense. And while, yes, I wasn't that fond of the fact that she tried to soothe his hurts with sex, I did buy it as something she might do. Especially while feeling that familiar tug of attraction she'd always felt with Dyson. Perhaps the writers were a little too unsubtle about that, but as a Team Badass fan it was appreciated. I don't think Bo will continue to bang Mark; she knows it would hurt Dyson. Which is also why the writers will predictably milk that tension of him finding out at some later date.

I really enjoyed the Bo/Tamsin dynamic; seeing them work out their issues and actually TALK through what was bugging them. The whole couples therapy schtick was hilarious. But we also got to see Tamsin drop the antagonism when Bo was wounded and switch back into caring/protective mode. I do think it's been made much more clear now that Tamsin has fallen for Bo. The way she tried to heal her was not perfunctory. There's a gif going around where you can see Tamsin's face after Bo's eyes charge up with blue and it's very vulnerable there. Then add in Lauren's interruption & you see Tamsin jerk back, obviously embarrassed by the intimacy which had been on display. Later she gets jealous of Lauren touching Bo's hand & acts out more aggressively. Bo seems still a bit confused & unsettled by these developments, but I am not convinced she is unreceptive to the possibility of a romance with her. I also enjoyed the confession scene where Bo reassured Tamsin that they were going to be good as partners, after all.

Gosh, this is turning into a big wall of text. Sorry.

Color me absolutely thrilled that Dyson is finally getting an arc that can be his OWN. Having a son thrust upon him that he never knew about is certainly one way to shake up the character who has been stagnating in loyal soldier/recharge battery mode. The possibilities are endless as to where the writers could take this. Let's hope they don't muck it up. Having his new-found fatherhood counterpointed with Vex's grief over losing his own crazy adoptive son was nicely done, I thought. I also appreciated that we got to (belatedly) experience Dyson's grief over the double losses of Hale & Kenzi. He may have blamed Vex, but it was obvious he was really blaming himself just as much.

Let's face it, he went to a really dark place in the episode. Lauren was frightened that he would follow through on killing Vex. We saw the shifter, the wolf, the predator shining through there. It wasn't pretty. But I was so happy that the writers allowed the character to reclaim some of his edge, to show darker complexities. Yes, Dyson is noble & tries to do what's right. But he also has been a trickster, someone who left a trail of broken bodies & broken hearts & lost valuables in his wake. Trick gave him a new mission once he realized just how much damage he was doing, but those less savory elements, the things he's not proud of are still a part of him. Which is why I really liked the writers' decision to allow Dyson to ruthlessly kill the hunter in the end. Because he knew the cycle of violence wouldn't stop, he needed to protect his son and he was damned well going to be unrepentant about giving over to his blood lust.

I actually almost teared up when Dyson was tightly hugging his son, refusing to let him go, refusing to let him commit murder himself. The look in his eyes was heartwrenching. I think the show did a great job of establishing a connection between the two. Of course, we can expect the relationship to be rocky since Mark is, after all, a lost teenager with major abandonment issues.

Other random thoughts: I confess I smirked when Bo casually mentioned Lauren as her ex. I also noticed that several times she & Lauren seemed out of synch. Bo was yeeuching at the parasite, Lauren was all 'I know, isn't it fascinating'. Then later in the lab Bo was kinda 'huh? don't know, don't care' while DL was geeking out over the ancient hunting knife. Compare that to Bo & Tamsin doing things in tandem while apprehending Mark, even speaking in complete unision. Coincidence or deliberate?

I'm sure there is ton of stuff I missed. Will definitely rewatch soon.

Final note: While it seems clear (to me, at least) Bo is more likely going to start something fun & new with Tamsin than try to reignite a bonafide romance with Dyson, that last scene where she visited him was really sweet. I really felt she cared about him & wanted to support him in any way that she could. He seemed to appreciate it too, even though he wasn't ready to talk/accept solace. Just seeing her touch his face, not judging him for the obvious signs of violence, kissing his cheek & respecting his request for definitely earned her some brownie points with me.

Too bad she's got that awful secret she's keeping from him now. Oh, well.
8. TheGardner
I hope everyone had a safe and happy holiday.

@whiskeywhite Regarding the previous episode, I took Lauren asking Dyson to put his shirt on as she was already uncomfortable and him being half naked added to it. Also, she is a neat-freak and probably didn't want him sweating all over her. Personally, I find KHR to be way to skinny and lacking in definition, especially for a character that is always running topless. So I was more than happy with someone finally telling him to get dressed. I dunno, build up those pecs buddy and maybe we'll talk.

I really liked this episode, for the most part anyways. I think KHR and that Degrassi kid over-acted in their scenes a bit, but didn't detract from the potentially interesting storyline. PRA was kind of a waste and really only served to hammer home what it means to be a father. Dyson directing his anger over Hale & Kenzi on to him, seemed a bit much.

Bo and Tamsin sharing that dude in the beginning and even her banging Dyson's son, felt in-character for this Bo. I was more annoyed that Tamsin banged someone in her bed. I mean hello, rude much?

Lauren and Evony scenes were great, I hope that they interact more this season. I also am enjoying Lauren being more integrated with everything and ZP's comedic touch being allowed to shine.

My biggest complaint this episode, and really all of them so far, is Tamsin. She's up, she's down, she's all over the place and quite frankly it's distracting. Why is she acting jealous over Bo and Lsuren? And what is with her pushing the feeding thing with Bo, is this her idea of romance? I hope that character gets sorted ASAP.
Suzanne Metaxas
9. SuzyM
In my opinion the woman in the elevator is Demeter, Persephone's mother. Now that the Triskelion has been revealed I am positive it is her. The Triskelion is the symbol of the triple goddess Persephone the maiden, Demeter the mother and Hecate the crone.
10. drusilla_doll
Ooh, yes, that would also make a perfect trinity. Hecate would be the riddling Leviathan? She did go all weird over the mark Bo had.

My only issue with this would be setting up the triple goddess concept as the ultimate 'baddy' for the final season. Which would a) be subverting three usually benevolent female goddesses -according to mythology - and b) make Bo's daddy a dud & anti-climax after multiple seasons of teasing his existence & machinations. He's supposed to be evil and we already had a not-really-evil fake out with Rainier last season.

Still, good catch.
12. jennifer333
i was so heartbroken and don't know what to do with myself but after 3 days of contacting , my lover came back to me
13. jdknight
The symbol was also in CHARMED. I do not trust or like Mark - he reminds me of Massimo's character. Bo cannot be blamed for having sex with him because she did not know who he was and she is a succubus! I find it rather odd that Evony would marry somebody she does not like. Is the rude butler like person her husband?
14. nypinta
@jdknight Evony is human now, so she had to marry the man she didn't like for his money. The butler like person was just a butler.

Although I'm sure Mark is going to be trouble, I don't think he's going to be anything like Massimo.

@drusill_doll Seeing as Lost Girl only uses mythology to give an extremely casual backround for whatever character, I highly doubt they'll care about altering the triple goddess of myth to suit their purposes, if that is what they are setting up. And seeing as they keep doing so much to tie everything in to the first season, I wouldn't be surprised if the "big bad" of the season ends up being a mother figure. Aife was in Season 1. Then seasons 2,3, and 4, the baddies were all men. Bookending it with another mother figure fits with the trend of this season so far.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
15. Kiersten
FTR I agree that Bo didnt know Mark was Dyson's son when she slept with him much as she didn't know Persephone was her stepmother when she slept with her. However, the *writers* knew what they were doing and the fact that they're prepared to perpetuate this creepy kind of emo/not quite incest bothers me. We know Bo is a succubus. We know that she has sex with a lot of random people. There are better ways of bringing that home then dipping into this creepy well.
16. nypinta
I think both times the writers were thinking only in the short term, but the audience too is placing their own values on Bo even though she exists in a world where those values aren't... I guess relevant is the only word that comes to mine. Applicable? But they needed Bo to have a guide, they wanted sexy times, the guide had to be someone tied to Bo's father, Hades. Boom--- Persephone. But she's Bo's step mother, technically, and for many that makes it kind of gross. But I think for Bo the only reason she was upset was the idea that she was being manipulated and that Persephone was working for her father. Once Persephone convinced her otherwise, Bo didn't seem to have any issue with sleeping with her despite the family ties. And in that case I don’t either, because if what Persephone says about her situation is true, she’s not really a wife any more than Aife would have been considered one. She’s another victim of Bo’s father, just a different kind of victim.

As for Mark, it's obvious that they wanted to play on Bo's attraction to Dyson since Mark is Dyson's son, I think they just thought it would be funny while also not being anything outside Bo's character because she's slept with clients before, like the married couple in S1, Cayden, Ryan wasn't a client but she met him via work, etc. It just so happens that this time the client was Dyson's kid. (Which, I do have a bit of an issue with his age more than his DNA. But at least it wasn't a "teaching moment" so... they didn't go *there* on top of it all.) And... I have to admit, the look on Bo's face when she realized was priceless.

For me, what happened in both cases was not unusual for Bo, so it feels more like us in the audience placing certain values on things like "step mom" being off limits regardless of how she is Bo’s step mother. But I do also think it's just too much too soon of sex partners having some connection she wasn’t aware of and it does make me wrinkle my nose a little bit at the idea of both encounters so quickly, seeing as with a little forethought they could have avoided it, but they went for the funny instead. Especially since in between them there was also Dyson at Lauren's, some random dude Tamsin had just moments before, and a few top offs by Tamsin herself. (Of all of them, Bo with the guy Tamsin just had is the one that bothers me the most for the sqwicky factor, because that's just weird, right?) However, I do find it funny (in a not at all funny sort of way) the jokes at Bo's expense floating around on tumblr and twitter. Weird how it's now the fans that are slut shaming her when the fans before took such umbrage on her behalf at the idea that Dyson did once, (which he didn’t). So reading the jokes about "God closing a door but opening Bo's legs..." and people referring to her as a slag all of a sudden is not fun. I mean, talking about what happened and why one would have issues with any of them is fine, but not sure why it’s OK to call Bo names now.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
17. Kiersten
Really?! They're slut shaming Bo that way? Jackholes. That's not right. I'm no slut-shaming her for having sex, in case that wasn't clear. I'm not thrilled about the fact that the writers are having her nail back-to-back familial connections, but I have zero problem with her having back-to-back partners. I think the sharing with Tamsin thing was a nod to guys (horrible, awful guys) or rather lad culture where sharing is a thing, a demoralizing, objectifying thing, which is exactly what Tamsin and Bo did to Tad/Frank. So that's more a consent issue again to me than a squick factor. And also think was to show how Tamsin and Bo as roommates is very, very different than Kenzi and Bo given that there are so many other things where Tamsin is actively working to recreate some of the Kenzi vibe for Bo. Tamsin has a history of disposal sexual partners as does Bo so while its kind of "mrrphh?" when they jump the same guy within minutes of each other, it's not out of character for either of them.

The slut shaming bothers me. It doesnt surprise me, but it bothers me a lot. Seems like the minute Bo starts having male partners again (something she hasn't had in a while excect when feeding off Dyson and the exceptionally egregious Rainer), she's a whore but with female partners & especially DL, she's a powerful, sexual woman.
Susan White
18. whiskeywhite
Oh my, such good discussion and so much to agree with. I should just make a list: "Ideas I agree with" and check them off.

Bad news about the slut shaming of Bo, but I'm not surprised either. Great discussion of her (and Tamsin's) approach to their sexual partners. "Cordelia/Connor" is a great comparison, @nypinta, if we're discussing 'ewww', although Cordelia knew exactly who Connor was and there's no question that Bo didn't know Mark.

A tiny nitpick (as usual) -- Mark didn't just randomly find Bo's place to hide. He was clutching a tattered copy of Bo's detective agency pamphlet (I remember because I initially had the same question about how he found his way to Bo's, as in "oh, come on").

If the Hale t-shirt is actually Dyson's own, then Ciara must have stomped on it in a coal pit, because I remember clearly that the original was shiny white (and seemingly unworn -- I mean, can we actually picture Dyson wearing that t-shirt, much as he treasures it?). But who cares about the details, right? Only us. We're those kind of fans. Or at least I am.

Speaking of badly done details, I agree completely, @nypinta, that the treatment of the mythology is at times "extremely casual". Lauren commented that the bone in the handle of the fancy knife was from the "Mesopotamian period of ancient Greece." I yelled at the TV: "There was no bloody 'Mesopotamian period' in ancient Greece!!!" (I guess you could say that there was a "Greek period" in the Mesopomian region after it was conquered by Alexander the Great in 332 BC, but not the reverse). Is this just carelessness? Are they making fun (of us)? Or suggesting that Lauren is mistaken to the point of being silly?
Susan White
19. whiskeywhite
I'm willing to concede :-), @TheGardner, that (Lauren) "is a neat-freak and probably didn't want (Dyson) sweating all over her." I thought about the sweatiness at the time (especially since her face was practically plastered against his chest as she climbed under the rope).

With sadness I also agree that KHR over acted in places. I know he had some heavy stuff to say, but it was a bit over the top (we've observed that he doesn't do 'crazy' well at all and there's a fine line here as he is being super emotional).

So good to have Vex back. He's working his way back into the team -- he was very helpful in coming up with the goat connection in Russian prisons. And the humour -- I did enjoy his musings on how mummies might feel about their portrayal in movies. Similarly, his response to Dyson's rhetorical demand, "Can you shut up?" -- "I don't think I've ever tried."

KHR teases Paul relentlessly that he is the only "classically trained actor" in the group. But he is a good actor. I found his defence of his love for Massimo more believable than Dyson's histrionics. Nitpick: What Vex said about Dyson's nose was that it was "slim" and "slender". I shouted at the TV again, "Slim and slender mean the same thing!" Sloppy writing or Paul flubbing the line?
20. drusilla_doll
This slut shaming of Bo in the fandom disgusts me. She's a succubus & the show is sex positive. I agree that the main impetus behind the nasty comments seems to be that she's been banging more men lately. Oh no, the dreaded sausage. Although, hello....Persephone? I suspect the disgruntlement is more that she's not remaining faithful to/not banging Lauren anymore. Get the fuck over it, kiddies. I am sure she'll be back to that soon enough, knowing Bo.

I've always hated the term 'sloppy seconds' so I hate it being an issue again, even though it's Frank/Chad who's going twice in the equation. Who cares. My only quibble is that he didn't look that keen/excited & it was played for laughs - which again shows that the show can be a little insensitive/tone deaf when it comes to consent. That, I think, is an issue worth discussing.

I may be one of the few, but I didn't feel there was bad over-acting with Dyson being grief-stricken, rage-filled, revenge-driven etc. I thought it was pretty believable & helped emphasise his more savage, predatory nature which always lurks beneath the surface. I guess I am okay with him being ANGRY instead of just angry, when push comes to shove. However, YMMV.

I am actually totally cool with Lauren's 'can you put a shirt on' request. I am not a fan of too much sweat myself unless it's during sex, so it didn't seem that unreasonable. It could have been played more laughs, true. I love KHRs body, I like lean & toned over buff & bulky. So, no thanks on the more pecs thing. Sometimes I think they look like man-boobs, which is an ick for me, personally.

I love Vex and I think Paul really sold his anguish & suicidal despair over losing Massimo, which is why he didn't attempt to control Dyson's body when death seemed imminent. He wanted to die from the sorrrow. It really made me feel for him and I think that helped put Dyson's new status & responsibilities into perspective. This is big. He has a son to shape, mentor, protect and do well by. If he fails, it will be soul-crushing. I am totally interested in where the journey leads.

Thanks Whiskeywhite in clearing up the 'how did Mark find Bo?' issue. I don't recall him finding an advert, but that helps make it more believable.
21. nypinta
@Kiersten I didn't mean anyone here was slut shaming Bo. I think we're pretty much on the same page about it all.

Regarding the t-shirt: it definitely is a different color. I'm thinking that Hale probably had a bunch made up in different colors and Bo has a lot of them. Probably thanks to Kenzi. This is based on nothing by my own assumptions. I bet Dyson still has his. I think they just wanted Mark in it because of his Dyson connection. And because we all miss Hale.

I think Vex just likes saying words that start with S. And being verbose because it bugs Dyson. ;P

I'm also in the camp that thought Dyson's reactions were perfect for the situations. His nature as a shifter is kind of taken for granted sometimes because we don't really get a sense of what that could really mean for him other than he smells stuff all the time. But he has an entire alternate entity in himself with instincts and emotions that are beyond normal human capacity or control and it felt more to me he was allowing himself to be fully unrestrained by the human like half of his being. I think sometimes it's a defense of Dyson's that when something is too hard for him to conciously bear, he retreats to his animal nature which expresses the emotions while he himself doesn't have to really examine them. He was doing that here, I think. And that comes out stronger than it would for just a man. IMO.
22. stacymd2
Hi All! I don't have much time, but wanted to say I enjoyed 504. Yay! I was excited to watch after reading the melt down online Sunday. I'm happy Dyson finally received a story arc. He hasn't had a story arc since S2. He also hasn't had an episode about him since S2's BrotherFae of the Wolves. I don't count 407's La Fae Epoque since that was about Doccubus with 1899 Bo.

Quick points: It is hard to take the online screeching from certain bullies seriously. The outrage is hypocritical. They seem to be upset mostly because Dyson has a storyline; Bo was supposedly not clear headed; Bo was attracted to and had sex with a man who has a connection to Dyson; & Bo didn't "rise above her biology".

1) Bo was clear headed this episode. She knew what she wanted to do and did it. No hand hickies in sight. The episode where she was not clear headed was 502, where Bo was being lead around by Persephone.

2) Bo & Tamsin are bisexual. They are attracted to both sexes. Bo does not lose her agency, intelligence, clarity, maturity, control or strength when she has sex with men. This is only said about Bo and only after she has sex with or shows signs of affection for Dyson/Ryan/Rainer or any man. No one accuses Kenzi of losing her agency when she has a boyfriend.

3) Bo didn't know Mark was Dyson's son. This gives her a pass because there was no intent to hurt anyone. Realistically, Dyson should be able to understand, there is nothing to forgive. I feel Lost Girl's writers will use this as a wedge between them. This is no different than: a) Dr. Freeze having sex with Bo because the Ash told her to; b) Dyson being "glimmered" into non-consentual sex with Aife; c) Bo having sex with Dyson's best friend Cayden; d) Dyson having sex with Hale's adult sister; e) Tamsin getting into Bo's tub and putting her boobs on Bo's knees; f) Kenzi & Dyson kissing when Bo was on a train. All sexually inappropriate, but all eventually forgivable situations.

4) Mark is an adult, 19. He may be new to "dancing" with a succubus. I didn't get the impression, however, that he has never been to a "dance" before.

5) Bo is a succubus. Bo is Fae. Succubus is a major part of who she is. Bo finally accepted who & what she is in S3, returning to the human closet is not an option. Reading the shaming and things like, "Bo didn't rise above her biology" is disheartening. To me, it is as ridiculous as someone stating, Wonder Lauren should rise above her biology and have sex with men. There was nowhere near the shaming & outcry when Waitress Lauren slept with Crystal and flat out cheering when Dr. Ethics screwed the Fae out of Evony for Bo.

6) There would have been no outrage if in 503, Bo had told everyone in her hospital room to get out, except Dr. Super Lauren. Then she proceeded to bang the Block of Wood, M.D. loudly as D & T talked in the next room. There would have been no outrage if Mark turned out to be Terrorist Lauren's brother and Bo banged him because his chi reminded her of Wonder Lauren. That would have been signs of doccubus's epic love. When it involves Dyson, Bo is awful.

Dyson has had to endure B & L kissing and rubbing their relationship in his face for two seasons. I don't feel sorry for Dr. Blackmail that she is made uncomfortable because Dyson & Bo banged or Tamsin & Bo kissed. At the end of the day, Lauren ended her relationship with Bo for valid reasons.

Finally, we all know by now that a doccubus sex scene is comming -- as well as a possible Valkubus scene. Lost Girl's writers will give each fandom their chance.

@drusilla_doll: I agree. KHR's acting was spot on. He had much more to do and much more to emote. So many, many emotions! Dyson is usually a stoic, cynical man. KHR had to play him in a situation we have never seen before. This is nothing like when Dyson lost his love. Whenever Dyson gets any focus or gets close to Bo, a certain fandom always has negative, personal comments about KHR's acting --- or his looks.
23. drusilla_doll
stacymd2: Thanks! I think it's a subjective thing and perfectly okay if people think KHR was too OTT. However, I feel that he was in a state that was meant to be OTT (unfettered rage & grief) in order to contrast with how usually stoic he is about his 'manpain', as detractors would say. Usually he pushes his own wants and emotions aside for the greater good or if Bo needs him to. I think the only other time he was close to this angry was when Taft imprisioned him & forced him to fight. But it was good to see just how upset he actually was over his best friend's death, Kenzi's loss and her sacrifice.

I also think KHR did a good job of showing how uncomfortable and at a loss he was in having to deal with a troubled son. Because on some level Dyson understands that desire to extract bloody revenge, to give in to savage impulses because of lost love/family/friends.

I agree that the outrage over Bo's current dalliances are hypocritical. Bo's not with anyone officially right now, and regardless of who she loves, she can sleep with anyone she wants to, as long as they are willing. Canada's age of consent is 16. Mark is apparently 19 according to the enhanced version of the episode. Bo did nothing wrong. As far as I am concerned, her only mistake is keeping it from Dyson rather than just fessing up.

I also take umbrage at the idea that Bo needs to 'rise above her biology'. I always was uncomfortable with the treatments Lauren was giving her. I get that initially Bo was scared of her own nature and didn't want to kill others - namely humans - if she had sex with them. But in the end, she shouldn't have to fundamentally change who she is, in order to be acceptable. It really does smack of the whole 'bi-sexuals are only going through a phase and lesbians just haven't found the right man to cure them' sort of deplorable arguments. Bo is not broken. She's a succubus, which means she is not a typical woman who just needs the true love/sexings of one particular human doctor in order to flourish & be happy.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
24. Kiersten
I completely agree that KHR did NOT overact. In fact, while watching I got chills esp when he held the gun under Vex's chin and I loved how PRA and ZP played the shock of that moment. They're so used to Dyson wolfing out, they forget he has a very human way of killing people. I thought it was a great scene to back up what Dyson was saying about how doing the right thing over and over was the harder choice than going with what feels right. You saw how difficult and conflicting it's been for Dyson for a long time, something that had deep, personal repercusions when he allowed Kenzi to choose her own fate and walk into the ziggarut. Yes, allowed, because he could have physically stopped her and chose not to in order to honor her decision.

Those scenes with Vex made me feel as though they'd FINALLY cut KHR loose from some unseen restrainet. It was so damn refreshing. They finally gave him something to do beside stoically reassert over and over and over again that Bo loves Doctor Lauren. Gag. It looked like KHR relished the chance to (heh) dig his teeth into something, much like ZP has looked as though she's thoroughly enjoying the chance to play DL as something over than moaning over Bo.

I caught the whole "do you ever shut up" bit too and snickered. That was a good throughaway moment between those two after a lot of emotional angst.
25. Lurker
Regarding the meltdown during this episode. Remember the fandom is not static. People disliked Bo's actions in Season 4 and some thought she was selfish. While I agree the current motives of Bo stems from Kenzi leaving her Bo will not get a benefit of a doubt from many because of last season. I did not have a problem with Bo sharing one of Tamsin's partners though I did think ick but whatever. I did have a problem with Bo sleeping with Mark. There you had someone who needed help and Bo's first reaction was to sleep wth him. I understand it was to show Bo's attraction to Dyson but a friend of mine brought up a good point. Imagine if we had this iteration of Bo in 3x11 towards a fae just as needy as Mark. Would she sleep with the Duppy. I guess so. That's why I disliked it. Look Bo can sleep with whoever she wants but I hated that Mark was dealing with his own issues and Bo's first reaction was to boink him.
26. nypinta
@stacymd2 "....screwing the fae out of Evony" is a phrase I'm totally going to steal. FYI. And I agree with pretty much every point you made. But maybe we could all not call any of the characters names?

Aside from the sudden judgements on Bo's sex life, most of the complaints that I am seeing do stem from the tendency of the writers to have important conversations off screen, which I think is something we can all relate too. Also, there is a disparity of what is available to work with regarding back stories between Lauren, a human, and other characters like Dyson, Trick, and Vex, seeing as they all have centuries of life for the writers to explore. So when something from their past is introduced it doesn't feel illogical or out of character. Where as with Lauren's backstory, they've attempted to add things to fill out her experience but they do not do it with enough care or respect for her and that is what I am most frustrated about concerning her. I know I've complained about it too, but most of the "super" all knowing stuff that is assigned to her is due to the constraints of the show. They need someone to do the explaining/science/ect. and it always falls on her character. If they just used a little more thought they could still get out the necessary plot points without hanging albatrosses around her neck all the damn time.
27. nypinta
Oh, I don't like Bo keeping what happened a secret from Dyson. But telling him right after he just discovered he had a son would not have been a good idea either. So... I think it'll just be something she just won't mention for a bit but finally fesses up too. I'm not sure how he'll react. I don't think it'll be jovial amusement, that's for sure! But... it better not be something that is used to create a divide between them. Because that would just be dumb.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
28. Kiersten
Two things: Vex cannot control Dyson with his powers because of Dyson's wolf alter ego. Vex's power doesn't work on animals so that animal aspect of Dyson makes him one of very few immune to Vex's power-on the show so far, he is unique. So Vex didn't "let" Dyson threaten him or choose not to use his power to stop Dyson. That was never an option.

Second thing - I can't remember. I lost it. It'll come back later.

Being a succubus *is* Bo's biology and the whole point of the show so far has been her learning to live with and, when needed to avoid killing people, control her power/nature/biology/whatever. One of the many problems with the doccubus relationship in this show is it effectively creates a false positive where some are able to crow that Bo really is a lesbian who occasionally lowers herself to sleep with men but only when she needs to power up. This episode clearly showed her enjoying not one, but two different men just for fun and emotional reasons (and later, healing, yes) after which she showed she still has a very deep, emotional bond with Dyson, one so compelling it was irresistible to Bo even in a diluted state in Mark.

That said, yes, the prominence of Dyson and Tamsin in these early episodes practically guarantees the return of doccubus banging any minute now. This show doesn't have the guts to do anything different. Unfortunately, that means it's almost all too certain the show is merely setting up Bo and Dyson for further discord by emphasizing his fealty and love for her and showing how much she does feel for him now. I've been burned too many times not to expect the ax to descend soon. Shame. 504 showed once again just how great and strong Lost Girl is/was when Bo and Dyson's relationship holds center stage one way or another.
29. nypinta
@Lurker Didn't Bo kill the Duppy? IIRC, she used her compliance power on her to calm her into sleep and the sucked all of her chi to kill her so she wouldn't be used as a weapon ever again. In that situation the very idea that Bo would consider that a moment for sex is really wierd. Mark did come to her for help, but his situation wasn't the same as the Duppy's at all. Nor was his state of mind. And I think Bo is smart enough to tell the difference between those situations.

@Kiersen, but Vex has controlled Dyson before. I think Dyson has to have reverted enough into his wolf to keep Vex from being able to control him and if Dyson doesn't Vex can use his Mesmer powers on him. The fact he didn't even seem to try and stop Dyson says more than whether or not he actually could. (Of course, it could have been a ploy because Vex knows who Dyson is and that he wouldn't do it if Vex wanted him too. Tricksy Vex!)
30. drusilla_doll
Sorry Kiersten, I had completely forgotten Dyson was immune due to his animal shifter nature. Makes sense. I had seen people elsewhere claiming it was ridiculous Vex didn't defend himself. He couldn't mesmer Dyson, so that option was out. Still, he made no effort to run away, fight or break free etc. I think that was because he was in a suicidal frame of mind due to his grief. Which explains his inaction.

Agreed, there's no reason not to think that by the end of the second half, we'll be getting another lame doccufest, despite this somewhat promising beginning. We already have Chekhov's shotgun on the mantle in the form of the Bo/Mark bang being kept from Dyson to be used when they need Bo/Dyson to be wedged apart again.

I suspect & fear that if we do finally get some Tamsin/Bo it might be used to remind Bo that while it's 'fun' it's not the same deep meaningful bond (/rolls eyes) she had with Wonder Lauren.

It's obviously not what I want to have happen, but I don't trust the writers one inch to be brave enough to fully move on from Doccubus for good.
31. TheGardner
I feel as though there is some hipocrisy afoot in this thread. During S3 when Bo was shown primarily only banging women, there were several negative and marginally homophobic comments made about the lack of 'man lovin'. The show was even referred to repeatedly as the supernatural L word.

I think the shipping has really gotten out of control, hence the slut-shaming. Bo isn't with who they want her to be with so they rage and cry on twitter. I am grossed out by the fluid exchange involved with Bo sitting on a dick Tamsin just slid off of, so I just pretend he took a shower first. As for Mark, I do not see the big deal. Bo and Dyson have been broken up for years, not that it should matter, but she didn't know who he was before and he's legal. I personally like seeing Bo behaving, not only as a succubus, but a single woman owning her sexuality.
32. nypinta
@TheGardener Although I don't have specific quotes, what I do recall as complaints about Season 3 wasn't the lack of 'man lovin' it was the fact that it seemed Bo wasn't allowed any encounters with men, period. And too often the show used a character being a man as the evidence of badness. From the very start in fact with the Hecuba episode where Bo outs the Warden as a man pretending to be a woman. Seems selling babies is ok if you're a woman doing it...? And then after Lauren recognized that she wasn't enough to feed Bo & they went out all of the men were immediately off the list, and IIRC pretty much everything Dyson did in that season was seen as him "interferring with Bo's autonomy" including him not telling her about his love (which isn't her business if he doesn't want her to know), offering himself as Hand in her Dawning, etc. yet the same people saying that about Dyson glossed over the fact that Lauren lied to Bo about her being sick and told Trick instead. Yet Dyson was the one on the show that gets the blame for Bo's state by Trick. The entire season had a whiff of man hate, specifically towards Dyson, about it, from the action on the screen and the reaction online after each episode.
Susan White
33. whiskeywhite
Oh dear, I should be working but I can't resist. More great discussion. Just a couple of points:

1) I agree completely that Dyson is right to be angry and to have all the other strong emotions with which he is wrestling. All the things that you folks eloquently explained. It's great to see that internal struggle getting some attention.

2) We need to distinguish Dyson the character from KHR the actor. A critique of the latter is not a criticism of the former. I am both Team Dyson all the way (at least when I'm not Team Polyamory) and a major KHR fan (shall I post a picture of the "Team Dyson" jacket I made for the recent opportunity I had to meet KHR in person?)

3) It is completely legitimate to critique an actor's performance; it is not at all the same thing as making negative remarks about them as a person or about their private lives.

4) Judging the quality of an actor's performance is, to a significant extent, subjective (just like "chemistry" which we discussed long, long ago). So a delivery which feels not quite right to one person can be totally right and convincing to another. I've watched a lot of KHR films and TV shows. My feeling is that he does better with quieter, more sensitive and affectionate moments than loud ones. We can contrast the expression on his face as he held Mark in his arms to his shouting at Vex. But as the saying goes, that's just me.

There is no doubt in my mind that they are going to make it a point of conflict between Bo and Dyson that Bo had sex with Mark. Sometimes I think I'm watching a high school TV series where the big crisis is whose boyfriend looked at whom, or who kissed whom (I know, sex is bigger).
34. drusilla_doll
Wow, I don't recall anyone making marginally homophobic remarks here, if they did, I hope those ppl no longer post here. I know that I personally have no problem with Bo hooking up with women for sex/healing or pursuing Tamsin as a possible romantic option, for example. I just thought Doccubus was and still is a crappy romance. When Bo was committed to Lauren, she was with Lauren. I wasn't squicked out about it, just couldn't stand the good doctor's personality & actions. I disliked how incompatible they seemed with each other, and how little they communicated honestly. There's a difference.

FTR: I enjoyed watching the L Word and probably am in the minority in having liked Jenny Schecter (have been a fan of Mia ever since).

Something that bugs me: fans blaming Dyson for not tattle tale-ing on what Lauren is up to with Bo. Seriously. Lauren is a grown woman. She can damned well call Bo herself & tell her what's going on if she's really worried about her own safety etc. That's called being an adult. But noooo it's all 'Dyson's a jerk for keeping *insert Lauren's current predicament* from her'. They'd have a point if she couldn't contact Bo herself, or had asked him to relay the info, but generally that's not what's going on. As soon as he realized Lauren was probably in trouble in S4, he informed Bo.
35. Stacymd2
NO ONE has EVER said anything homophobic on this forum -- not marginaly or otherwise. To say that is grossly untrue, offensive and mean spirited.

I read the nastiness on & The L Chat zetaboards, @The Gardener.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
36. Kiersten
@whiskeywhite - when did you see KHR? I ask only in curiousity as to whether I too was there and somehow missed meeting you.

Also, I have no problem with people have differing opinions regarding KHR's performances so long as it's universally recognized that I am right. (kidding. mostly. I *am* a Leo after all.) I do, however, think he gets unfairly criticized when he has more dramatic moments like in this episode. Actors have range and, for a change, Lost Girl gave KHR the chance to flex his.
37. drusilla_doll
@Whiskeywhite: I totally agree that acting performances are subjective. It's cool if you think Kris wasn't believable there. I feel the same way about Bo's grieving scene in 5.03. While I totally understood her reaction, and sympathized, I felt it was one of Anna's weaker acting moments in terms of portraying her emotional state. In comparison, I think Ksenia Solo KILLED her reaction scenes to Hale's death, & Rachel Skarsten seems to flit from obnoxious IDGAF gal to conflicted/vulnerable/insecure gal and back with ease.
Suzanne Metaxas
38. SuzyM
I disagree with anyone who says this board is homophobic, somehow if you don't like the character of Dr. Lauren you are branded as such. Many people have a problem separating fiction from real life, I don't like Dr. Lauren the character, I DO LIKE Zoie Palmer the person.

The one thing I like about this season so far is the writing is way better than it has been in a long time and the writers are giving the actors something to work with :) I have seen great acting from ALL the cast because they have something to work with for a change! I must disagree with those who say KHR over acted his part, I think he nailed it and made you feel his pain and suffering. I too like it better when he is playing the calmer, gentler part and shows his winning smile.
39. jdknight
People appear to forget that most of the people in Lost Girl are not human and cannot be judged by modern standards of morality. Bo is a succubus. She requires sex in order to survive. She may have a few loving relations but the majority of her sexual encounters are snacks required to allow her to live. There is no emotion involved. Bo is a sexual preditor - that is her nature. She can heal by face sucking chi but that is not a full feed. She is not human and cannot be expected to have the same morality as a modern day human. Most modern day humans instinctively abhore incest. I personally harbor no romantic feelings toward any members of my family but ancient Greek and Roman gods as well as ancient Egyptian royalty regularly practised incest and no one though anty the worse of them. In fact modern day royalty has come close to practising incest as can be seen by the, for example, Habsburgs and incest is, so I have been informed, amongs various Hillbilly clans. Neither Persephone or Mark are blood relations of Bo. She considered them snacks and no one can blame her for that or for snacking off Tamsin's friend after Tamsin had finished. I do not know why Bo and her roommates like sleeping in each other's beds - Bo and the oracle were in Kenzi's bed when Bo went into Dyson's body. Evoney should be a multibillionaire from her various businesses and should not need to marry anyone for money - I am sure she is making money out of the hospital that Lauren is running. I cannot understand why Lauren let that butler be so rude to her - totally out of character. I still do not trust Mark - how do we know for certain that he is Dyson's son? He may be a potential shape shifter but he could be anyone's offspring. Maybe his plan is to destroy Dyson for whatever reason? This is where Kenzi is missed - she would have 'outed' him but after her serious mistake with Massimo maybe not - the whole Massimo thing was totally out of character for Kenzi especially since she knew what he as right from the beginning. Vex will probably come out as a hero. From what I understand he can affect Dyson whist he s in human form but not once Dyson has changed and he has no control over Dyson shifting. Vex has a lot of guilt issues. It will be interesting to see the next meeting between him and Evony. If she is no longer the Morrigan who is. As Trick is still acting Ash and he is still running the Dal - who is doing all his work as Ash and where are his guards hiding? We have only seen them lurking around ineffectively once during the Russian opera singer episode
40. TheGardner
Oh ffs, I was not calling this site or any of its contributers homophobic. If I thought that, I wouldn't post here. I was making a parallel between the current track about Bo 'going straight' on the Doccubus sites and the S3 LG=Lost Gay that went around the DyBo boards.

Anyways, the scene where Mark attacks the hunter bothered me. Here we have the second major altercation taking place within the confines of Lauren's lab in a day and she just stands there saying 'Stop!' Hello, call security, damn.

I think Dyson's 'love interest' this season will be his son. TamBo either needs to happen or it needs to stop, it's getting really weird. I think Bo and Lauren are going to have something together next episode. And I am curious to see what the deal is with Elizabeth.

@drusilla_doll I wasn't a fan of the L word , especially after Dana died, but I have never wanted to see a character killed as much as I did Jenny Schecter. Drowning was too good for her.

Happy New Year guys, play safe.
41. drusilla_doll
I liked her in all her dysfunction, but have no problems with those who hated her guts with a fiery passion.

I agree that Mark will likely be Dyson's 'love interest' for the season and I am pretty okay with that. I think he's a better fit for Bo than Lauren, but I know there are a lot of people who disagree. If Dyson can get a meaningful arc through dealing with Mark, I will be much happier than I have been with some of the plotting errors of the past two seasons.

Sorry, never saw the Lost Gay thing around the boards, myself. I did, however, see multiple complaints that Dyson (Lost Wolf) or Tamsin (Lost Valkyrie) were ruining the show. Showcase blog was especially rife with such comments.
42. Lurker
@nypinta Both the Duppy and Mark were in vulnerable states. Also I don't know if Bo can make a sound decision since she has shown to make a bunch of lousy decisions last season.
43. nypinta
I've never seen any other Dyson neutral, let alone positivie, boards. And I've never heard the term "Lost Gay" either. (Not saying it hasn't happened. Just not anywhere I've seen.)

I don't think the butler was rude to Lauren. He was just doing his job. But she was doing accents at him and making Downton Abby jokes at him, which I'm sure he's never heard before.... ;) I think that the Dark probably took all of Evony's money from her businesses with them, just as they seemed to do to Vex when he lost his mojo and couldn't Mesmer anymore. The Dark are pretty ruthless and the idea of "taking care of our own" only seems to apply as long as you are useful to the Dark. Evony no longer is. So she had to make her own arrangements. So she married rich. The clinic will probably make money. Evony might be ruthless and cruel and heartless and all... but she's not stupid and recognizes money as power so she's not going to flitter it all away. BTW, that makes me wonder if Lauren is a target more because other fae will want her serum to take out their own enemies than she is a target because she dared defae one of their own. Like I said, the Dark are ruthless. They might see what she's created as an asset more than a threat to be removed.

But in Lauren's defense at the clinic with Mark and the Hunter, yeah she took care of fae that threatened her, but she had time to consider and get her hands on something. She's being trained by Dyson, but it's still not her automatic response to jump in as action girl. So, she gets a bit of a pass on that from me.

I do think Mark is Dyson's son. Dyson says he can tell, so that's good enough for me. It'll be interesting to see how Mark reacts when he finds out Dyson took out the hunter. (If they bother showing that on screen, I mean.) But from the promo it looks like Mark will start working at the Dal. As a favor to Dyson or is Trick trying to replace his wolf that he lost because Dyson is now Bo's man? Ooo! I do keep wondering if Dyson and Trick are ever going to have it out. Dyson does seem to have a few issues with Trick, mostly the fact Trick keeps way too much to himself and it always comes back to bite them all in the ass. Bo too. Is she ever going to have it out with Trick?

And I get that both Mark and the Duppy were in vulnerable states... but Mark was less so. The Duppy just learned shocking news about her entire existence. Mark had been dealing with his issue for a while and clearly knows how to compartmentalize. He was calm enough to hit on the girl on the bus, steal from Bo and Tamsin, and con his way into town to begin with. He's got a bag full of cheap watches so he can play the lost kid looking for a break. He has issues, sure. But he's also not weak. Not that I'm saying it as all AOK, just I don't see the two specific scenarios as compairable. But, it does raise the issue of how when things happen to men (or boys) it's seen as OK usually but if it was a female it wouldn't. I mean, if Mark in his circumstances came to Bo but was Marcia instead... how would people have reacted if Bo took a 19 year old girl that was on the run to bed? I don't think people would find it as funny.
44. nypinta
@drusilla_doll I just saw your post about Levi being Hecate and part of the possible tri-goddess! That would tie her in nicely and give her more of a point and I am definitely for that.

I did google the Triskelion....thingy. It has several meanings and sources. Including Celtic. So who knows what they might do with it. Could be in refrence specifically to Persephone, Demeter, & Hecate. Could be something they will create that is even older, as the symbol itself if neolithic, as in from the Stone Age. So it's both something old and something new. (Which kind of reminds me of the wedding poem... and Kenzi calling Bo her "something blue".)
Susan White
45. whiskeywhite
Kiersten, Kris was in Winnipeg for the Central Canada Comic Con (4C) in early November, with Paul and Rick. Mary D was thinking of coming and we were going to hook up (ahem, I mean meet) but she didn't come in the end. I would have loved to have met you (or any of you LG fans). But I understand, we are far (although we are actually at the geographic centre of North America).

Kris and Paul also appeared on the Captain Canuck panel. (That's a comic book and animated web series for those who are not rabid KHR followers). I was interested to learn that the Captain was created in Winnipeg. Paul attempted to make a joke about 'Winterpeg's' infamous weather by refusing to emerge from a giant parka. But only Winnipeggers are allowed to joke about our "colder than Siberia in the winter" climate. (For our non-Canadian friends, this isn't even northern Canada; we're an hour's drive from the US border. Granted, that border is with North Dakota). :-)

I finally got to ask Kris a question with which I've been obsessed for some time -- why, as someone who grew up in and near Toronto, does he drop the 'g' in words ending in 'ing'. He says comin', goin', etc. Totally atypical. To my surprise he said he was unaware of it and no one had ever pointed it out to him before. He said he tries to suppress his Canadian accent for the sake of his career in the US, and demonstrated it with a non-Canadian pronunciation of 'out' which, aside from 'eh' is our dead giveaway.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
46. Kiersten
@whiskeywhite - I didnt know you'd gone to that con. Good for you!
Susan White
47. whiskeywhite
My first Con ever. I also got to meet Graham McTavish who was there because he plays one of the dwarves in the Hobbit movies. But he's also (and more yummy-ly) Dougal MacKenzie in Outlander. We discussed being McTavishes (or in my case MacTavish, as my mother was a MacTavish).
48. nypinta
Just watched it again, and again Vex's claim that Dyson let Massimo go bugs me. Because he didn't. It was Vex who let him go.

I also noticed how casually Lauren mentions Evony now being human outloud to the butler, as if he knew she was once Fae. I highly doubt it, so it struck me as odd.

The Hunter (did they say what kind of fae he was?) mentioned the Una Mens as if them being dead is the reason he took up hunting shifters again, but Mark's story is that the hunter killed his mom when he was a kid, meaning years ago. The Una Mens have only been gone for a few months. It was a nice try of them implying that fae are going to think they can take up old grudges, break laws, and generally run amok without the the fear of the Una Mens coming after them, but this doesn't fit the timeline. Plus, I don't think the Una Mens were the only reason fae lived by the Blood Laws. They were just the most fearsome reason.

I still don't like the idea of Mark's mom not ever having told Dyson about Mark or Dyson's self recriminating comment about not being a commitment kind of guy back then. Unless he lied to Piper about their relationship just to get in her bed, she was with him of her own free will and knew what kind of relationship it was. She chose to not tell Dyson she was pregnant and if I were him I'd be angry that she took his chance to be a father to Mark from him by not telling him.

I made jokes about Mark being a combination of Bo, Kenzi, and Dyson. Just realized that Tamsin also tied herself into that mix with her confession to Bo at the end that after "Valkyrie school" (which BTW sounds like a cheesy spin off option of catty mean girls learning how to create doubt and choose worthy warriors for Freya at a Nordic Hogwarts like fae high school).

Someone somewhere mentioned that Tad didn't look thrilled to be double teamed when Tamsin left him with Bo, but upon the second watch what he really looked was nervous. Perhaps thinking he wasn't going to be up to the task, as it were. I think he was more intimidated than anything. (At least Bo got his name right.)

They mentioned the "three from the elevator" twice. I mentioned it somewhere else (I think) that in the screen shot of the episode where we see candle lady in the elevator, there are about 8 people. (I think the man with his back to the camera is Hades, BTW) but even if you remove him, there were still more than 3 people in that elevator. So.... where did they go if they only found 3 humans and 1 fae dead body?

I noticed that some of the action didn't quite match up with the text that was in the script according to the enhanced video. Like when Bo and Mark were together. It cleary says that he kisses her first and she tries to resist but can't, but in the scene she leans in for the kiss first. The script also has Tamsin "making out" with Bo, her being into it more than Bo, and later her expression is of a vulnerable smile... so they are definitely writting it as if Tamsin's in love with Bo, while Bo is not interested.

And I thought of this the other day while at work... last season Bo accepts the necklace that Lauren never actually gave her. Their conversation takes place after Bo and Lauren had fought over Rainer and Lauren announces that she had joined the Dark and had been keeping things from Bo all for her. After Bo saves Lauren from Massimo she sees that Bo has on the necklace and is happy, and then tells Bo that she's "hers" and I know a lot of people assumed (and I can see why) that it was Bo choosing Lauren, but what if that conversation was actually a call back to Bo telling Lauren she would claim her and at the time Lauren says no, because she was lying to Bo then. What if she meant that she was Bo's to claim if she wanted. And Bo did claim her. With Lauren no longer working for the Light and after de-faeing Evony she's sure as hell not working for the Dark anymore... Bo claiming her would be a layer of protection. Most other fae don't want to go up against Bo now. Some will still try. But if Lauren was completely on her own I don't think Evony funding her would be enough to keep her safe. So, that would explain why their status now is so different than what people assumed their conversation meant at the end of Season 4. (Not to mention right after they had that conversation Bo lost Kenzi and it would be super weird if she once again commited to a relationship when she had so much that she needed to focus on instead, which was getting Kenzi back.) They do seem to be leaning towards Bo still having feelings for Lauren while her feelings towards Dyson have shifted and she has so far no interest in Tamsin. But, I also noted the look on Bo's face when Dyson was first telling Bo he wanted to be alone... and the one thing you don't do to Bo is tell her no. She realized what he was saying and her face completely changed to understanding. But it reminded me that Bo seems to do this thing where someone will reject her and she works extra hard to get them to want her just so she can reject them later. So far she's done it to both Dyson and Lauren.

BTW, was a comment deleted? The numbers don't match.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
49. Kiersten
They're was a spam comment that has since been deleted. I agree with what you said about Bo & Dyson but if I remember right, her expression changed when she saw the blood on his face & realized he'd killed Kelly. However, I've said before that it'd be interesting to see Bo's reaction should/when Dyson hook up w/another woman and she suddenly has to deal with really being without him again. Despite his loss of love for her, she hated him being with Ciara. And Bo does *not* do well w/rejection & the surest way to have her pursue someone is to have him/her reject tell her no.

Having DL claimed by Bo makes sense but I dont think the writers thought DL's sitch all the way thru to that conclusion.
50. drusilla_doll
Dyson technically doesn't kill Massimo when he had the chance when he, Kenzi & Bo go to confront him together. He wolfs out & looks like he's about to rip out his throat, but Massimo whispers something in his ear & inexplicably Dyson decides to keep him alive for information - which pisses off Kenzi who wants Massimo dead. Maybe that's what's being referred to?

As for the hunter's claim, it clearly was BS, since he's been hunting Mark since the murder of Piper - if Mark is telling the truth and I believe that part of his story.

I still don't really get what was supposed to have happened in the elevator. Why some people's faces were obscured/hooded or backs turned unless it's supposed to have significance. Generally people face the same way in an elevator - at least in my experience. The elevator just crashed? But didn't we hear animal growls or other sound effects during the screaming? And why did blond woman also die? Interesting point that the body count doesn't match up.

As for the enhanced script discrepancies, I do believe Mark initiated the first kiss IF you count the 'healing' one leading up to the capture of the hunter. Isn't that the first time she says 'wow' or something to that extent?

Tamsin does initially kiss Bo for healing, but you can sort of tell by her eagerness, the repeated kiss after the initial one and the vulnerable face when she asks 'better' that there's more feelings in the mix there. For Tamsin it was becoming a make-out until Lauren interrupted, imo. I agree that Bo's still confused & not really as into it as Tamsin may be. For now.

Interesting speculation on what the necklace & 'I'm yours' declaration might mean plotwise. There was an issue with Kenzi being unclaimed in 5.02 when dealing with Freya, so yes, we might get a mushy scene where Bo officially claims Lauren as her human to protect her (with it also doubling as a 'we're back together' moment. Ugh). If it happens, well, at least some prior tought would have been put into it. I'm still scratching my head at the disastrous writing concerning Rainier as a random new love interest. Writers: Hahaha NOT EVIL, we fooled you! Oops he's dead, never mind.

There was a spammy comment posted, not appropriate for the board. I flagged it when I saw it. I presume its deletion is the reason the numbers don't match.
51. nypinta
No, they probably haven't thought Lauren's status through, or if they had they haven't made any effort to explain it to the audience. They love to make things ambiguous but usually in a way that's kind of frustrating and feels more like they can't think of another way to keep people interested in what will happen next. And I think the necklace really was just product placement. They used Lauren as an excuse to introduce it, it was a prop for one scene, but Bo wearing it was nothing more than advertisement and didn't mean what everyone hoped it did. People noted her wearing it as if it was evidence of commitement, even though what both Bo and Lauren were saying countered that, and now that Bo isn't wearing it there is consternation that it's gone. It's almost cruel.

BTW, I do think a line of kimonos would be a great show related product. They could do a black one with wispy smoke as the pattern. A pattern for each main character... and if possible ones that look just like the various kimonos that Bo has had over the years. (She's always had more than one, she just seemed to have favored the red one the most.) Actually, the show has a ton of stuff that they should have merchandized and is it just totally American of me that I'm baffled that they haven't?

@drusilla_doll, maybe Vex meant that Dyson didn't kill him, but he was saying it while trying to get across that Massimo was like a son to him so trying to goad Dyson by mentioning that he failed to kill him seems off. I think they actually forgot it was Vex that let Massimo get away when Kenzi asked for Vex's help to kill him.

I do recall that Dyson specifically mentioned the bike messenger as one of the dead bodies, and that was the one character turned to the side, while there was another mad with his back turned in a black suit with a white collar just like in The Wanderer card. So my speculation is that he was in there as Hades but the realized everyone would find just one guy turned around as odd so they turned other people to the side to cover for it while at the still time planting him there. (It seems to fit with their tendency to not to commit to things. Like Rainer!)
Kiersten Hallie Krum
52. Kiersten
In the lab, Dyson said something about how the hunter has been hunting shifters for centuries & then reminds the hunter that they're under Fae law now which prohibits such fae on fae outright violence. So I think the hunter killed Piper before those laws were in place or more likely that he didnt care so long as he didn't get caught. Then, after Dyson reminds him, he says he thought the ambiguity after the Una Mens were killed made it open season again. So while Mark says the guy has hunted him all his life & clearly he's been on the run in one way or another most of his life, I dont think the hunter's actively started hunting him again until after the Una Mens were killed.
53. nypinta
I'm not sure about him killing Piper before any laws were in place. In fact, if he cites the Una Mens at all makes me think the laws prohibiting fae hunting fae goes all the way back to the laws Trick wrote. I took it more as an inconsistency by the writers and an attempt to tie the Una Mens into the story, like Bo killing them is going to unleash a rash of fae violence, except his brand of violence has nothing to do with Bo killing the Una Mens, because he's been ignoring the law for years.

Same with the number of people in the elevator. It's as if the script writer and whoever arranges such scenes for the camera are not paying attention to one another...

Which reminds me of something else. Why would the fae bring the bodies of the people killed in the elevator to Lauren? She doesn't work for the Light anymore. She's funded by a former Morrigan, but Evony was outed, so I don't think she's still Dark. Claimed by Bo or not, Lauren would be the last person most of the fae would trust with cases, even if Trick does trust her. As acting Ash he does still have to think of his position and if the Light start to question his actions as trustworthy or not he's not going to stay acting Ash for very long. It'd be interesting if a sub plot was another fae campaigning against Trick for the role of Ash and uses Trick's association with Bo against him.
54. J.Fall
I think S5 might suffer from the hope they would get another season and start off in a direction that will be retconned with the remaining few episodes going back to status quo.

Not a big fan of Dyson as I don't think KHR ever really got the emo thing down well enough, he just came off as rude and grumpy rather than mysterious and tortured. Having said that, not being Fae, I don't think like one and if I had any hopes of a Dyson and Bo happy ending, it wouldn't be with all the wedding guests having carnal knowledge of the bride with a side order of son and step-Mom. And please, new guy was familiar because he was Dyson's son, if anyone clings to that as somehow enhancing Dyson, well, looking for scraps is all I say. He doesn't look a bit like Dyson and he's never met him in his life, so what is Bo now a DNA sex sensitive. The writers are obviously having a hoot!

Bo's sex positivity is increasingly like a guy in days of yore that banged a new woman every episode and therefore all these short relationships were actually meaningless and transient. The showrunners have clearly picked up on the growing criticism in this vein by saying Bo doesn't fall in love every five minutes but has connections????? I'm not sure what this means, do we have a grading system of meaningful lovers, not so meaningful lovers, feeds.

Dyson and Lauren who both did appear to have an idea of the sort of relationship they wanted with Bo now seem to be just there to be used and abused and take anything. They seem almost thralled. Tamsin seems on the way to joining the club and indeed with repeated feeding surely our gang must suffer the same effect that Bo's feeds do, i.e. feelings of attachment created by her Succubus powers. Of course Bo's powers and feeding/healing needs change with the whim of the plot so there's nothing that really holds as canon in this mishmash of a fantasy world. It still amazes me that people try and discern something from mythology or runes to discover the plot because there's not enough guidance or control of each individual episode towards creating a whole coherent arc. Hence the myriad of loose ends.

The only prediction I can make about the future is that Bo's Dad with be a total bust and shippers will be disappointed. LG is on part with Adam West's Batman, not to be taken seriously and enjoyable if you're in on the joke.
55. nypinta
The thing with Bo's reaction to Mark could mean several different things. That she was attracted to him as Mark but the familiarity kept being triggered and she reacted to it, but it wasn't why she was attracted to him. It could just mean that one of Bo's sensitivities is pheromones. They played it off as Bo's attraction towards Mark was soley his connection to Dyson, but he's got enough going on to make him someone Bo would willingly be with sans any DNA to a former lover. He's hot, young, built, tragic. Bo nip. So other than it being really awkward, I don't think it actually means anything.

No I don't think it's possible to suss out what they are going to do based soley on the mythology that they use, seeing as they never use it to line up with the stories we all know. But it's fun to look into what could have inspiried the story and use what we know of how they like to skew known mythology to fit the show. But I guess like the stock market, past performance is not a guarantee.

I don't think Bo is going to end the show getting married to anyone. It would be funny (but that's probably not really the word for it) if it turns out that Bo realizes all of the people in her love life are so dedicated to her only because of the thrall like effect. I have often wondered why she doesn't question it herself. Why Dyson and Lauren would be so willing to do the things that they've done for her since she started out not thinking that much of herself given her own past. Would someone that spent 10 years thinking she was a freak and feeling so guilty about the bodies she left behind really be capable of accepting the love and devotion of people like Dyson or Lauren? I don't think so. But she does. She almost expects it. Is that Bo as a person, or a part of her nature as fae? And now Tamsin is falling in line in the same exact way. Maybe she'll finally question it when it becomes to hard for her to ignore Tamsin's obvious feelings for her anymore.
56. J.Fall
Yes, actually, the most tragic consequence of Bo's powers could be that she actually can't be loved by anyone she has sex with. That leads back to Kenzi again or any non-sexual relationship that rings true being her only authentic source of love. Unfortunately, by now, and the load of bs the show has perpetuated, that kind of organic tragedy would be at odds with a nonsense show.
57. nypinta
The show could very well end with Bo choosing to become human and leaving everyone to go live with Kenzi in Spain. I would laugh and laugh and laugh and laugh.
58. J.Fall
Hate to point out that Lauren is also human and has put herself in friendzone, what does she know? Seriously, I could see Bo chosing human for her sigs lifetime. It would actually be poignant end of the show and give something to all sides if Bo chose to live out a life with her humans before returning to the Fae.
59. nypinta
Yes, Lauren is human. But if my previous pondering is correct and Lauren's dedication to Bo is simply due to Bo's powers as a succubus, Bo might not be interested in carrying on anything once she becomes human. The idea is that she gives up everyone but the one person that was never effected by Bo's fae superpower and that person is Kenzi. So she wouldn't be choosing humans, plural. She's be choosing Kenzi. And what ever comes after, with no ties to her previous life as a fae. No strings attached.
60. J.Fall
Maybe but Bo's original wishes were to not be Fae and to have a normal relationship with kids and the picket fence. She wanted to be rid of her abnormal affliction. It would actually mean something if she came full circle, otherwise she needs to be Queen of the Fae and bring back order and equality to the Dark and Light. Yawn .... Whatever ...
Kiersten Hallie Krum
61. Kiersten
I think Bo has long past the point of wanting to be human. S3 showed her that a monogamous relationship with her picket fences fallacy was not going to work for her and already in S5 she's learned that she really, really doesn't like it when her power doesnt work. The Bo in S1 who was afraid of her power is long gone. Now she reveals in it and while the control issue has shifted from learning not to kill people to learning not to go evil and take over the world, Bo clearly has come to value and rely on her Fae power and given the choice, I seriously doubt she'd choose to give it up. That would be an organic progression for Bo, learning that her humanity or lack thereof, isn't necessarily a bad thing esp since she can't protect the people she loves without being Fae.

However, LG doesnt do organic anything so I can totally see her regressing in character to become human and/or giving up her humanity as a stubborn "you don't get to tell me what to do" reaction to somebody saying she has to remain Fae. She's more than capable of screwing herself sideways (metaphorically, though probably literally if she put her mind to it) just to buck the system/authority. She's doesn't always make good or the right choices especially when someone gives her an absolute or ultimatum.
62. J.Fall
But even you Kiersten must see that the poetry of her situation is to be other than her biology. This was the orignal story. Other than that we have a Succubis that's technically not much better than Aife. In fact apart from an overt acknowledgement of thralling, Bo's relationships aren't much different.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
63. Kiersten
The original story is that she would live the life she chose, not one dictated to her by thousands of years of Fae law or tradition. That doesn't automatically mean "make herself human". It can be argued that she chose human rather than light or dark in the premiere episode more out of a desire not to conform than one to keep her humanity. As the unaligned succubus, she definitely has shaken up the Fae way of doing things. Were she to leave it at the end by being human, she would not be able to see her grandfather or any of the people she loves in the Fae world without being claimed by one of them. Can you see Bo being claimed? And having swallowed the red pill and seen the world behind the world she thought she knew, can you see her turning her back on that knowledge to live a normal, boring human life? I can't and I think it'd be a *major* cop out if that's the direction the show went in the end. It's not dealing with her issues or problems or the complexities of her Fae nature. It's abandoning it all to crawl back to her "original" version (not truly original b/c she's always been Fae but emotionally original b/c she thought she was human all those years). It's a MacGuffin. "I can't deal and/or You can't tell me what to do with it so POOF I'm no longer Fae and so don't *have* to deal with it anymore. So there." Lame.

Also, it's toward the end of S1 when she says to Dyson that she is more than her biology meaning that she believed she could overcome her nature to follow her heart into a monogamous relationship with him. So that's not actually part of the original story but part of her progression as a Fae/succubus. Even though Dyson never asked or expected her to do that, she was trying out of love for him and recognition of *his* nature, which is monogamy. He was trying to be upfront and honest about his nature and his willingness to work to get beyond it for her sake and she was doing the same. But they never got the chance to figure out how to make both their natures work in their relationship. And when she tried it w/DL in S3 by following the doc's rules for outside feeding, it was a total disaster. So I think the idea of "overcoming her biology" has been put to rest as all parties involved are well aware now that she can't and, frankly, really doesn't want to anymore.

I agree there's an argument that her relationships are becoming more like Aoife's thralls, but I think that's more a BTS writers' inability to stop playing to all the 'ships and less an organic progression, thought out character journey about how Bo's lovers are really her thralls and/or how she can never know whether or not they love her for her or because of her power. Actually, that'd be a *great* character dilemma, but it seems more accidental byblow than an actual choice by the show. Besides, Aoife's thralls were basically zombies and, so far, Dyson, Tamsin, and DL have managed to continue to exhibit free will for the most part, which sometimes has meant refusing Bo in one way or another...and she "lets" them refuse her when she could push them to do what she wants/needs. The few times she *has* pushed them, like with Dyson in S2E2, she's pulled herself back or been pulled back by their reactions. The only times she hasn't pulled back were when she did group chi suckage to save people's lives. So the thrall concern has merit but has so far been overcome one way or another.
64. J.Fall
It's interesting that Bo's original 'fix me' premis is so abhorent to some but then if that happened she wouldn't be Fae. Why are Fae so special, most of the time they're selfish opportunists. It's interesting that some people on the thread take up Evony's cause as being an abused Fae when she has constantly tried to kill Bo, sending out assassins and then callously killed a wedding party just so that she could take over the venue for a shindig. Directed Vex to make a mother kill her children and yet boo hoo was heinously robbed of her power by DL as you call her. Recently, she's made it obvious being stripped of her Fae hasn't given her any more insight than 'poor me." A human was killed in Lauren's lab but hey, no-one messed up the equipment so thumbs up.

I think the show lost their way when everyone, human and Fae became amoral. The funniest episode being when Bo went to see her Alzheimer Mum who couldn't have a coherent discussion with her and Bo lamented that everyone was cruel to her because they didn't understand when she killed that boy. 'I'm Fae Mum, it's okay, we kill people but it's just for food, why didn't you understand?" You couldn't really spoof LG, it's so unwittingly stupid it would be hard to parody.

Really, it's okay for people to like different ships but when you look at the actual show, it's ridiculous and to take on hate for people in the show is riduculous too.
65. nypinta
Oh, count me in on folks that really did not like the Bo Goes Home episode. I yelled at my TV a lot in that episode. The whole attempt to make Bo's faeness an allegory for coming out to a disapproving parent while for some odd reason her mother is out of her mind with dementia while oh surprise there is a COMPLETELY UNRELATED fae haunting her former High School pas made zero sense. And it made me sad. (So I rewrote it in my head.)

And I don't feel sorry for Evony one bit. Except for the part that for some reason the show always uses her to be humiliated in sexual situations and why is that OK? So, it's possible to see what Lauren did as not OK while still thinking Evony is horrific and evil. Which is where I'm at with her character. As much fun as she is to watch. Although I am not sure it was Evony that ordered Vex to kill Luann's kids. We were never told how long ago that happened so it could have been someone else as Morrigan. But she probably would have if she was so it doesn't really matter.)

But I do agree that if Bo chose to become human it would be a cop out. Although if it is the one thing that would keep her from being her father's pawn, I can see her doing it. She would willingly walk away from a role someone else created for her, which seems to be what they are setting up. Her father seems to have chose Aife to create Bo to be the Queen and rule the Earth and blah blah blah and Bo's real superpower is taking the choice not offered, so not Light or Dark but team human. Take this card or that, nope, the one from the deck. Her Dawning was her doing the thing she was told not to. Choosing to become human would mean not being a pawn anymore and I think Bo would rather live a life free from the fae even at the cost of her succubus nature.
66. J.Fall
Actually, to settle the Fae and choose human would go full circle but I very much doubt that will happen. It would make a weird sense of the whole thing and LG has an allergy to that. Also, I think it will be left on a sort of cliffhanger because they want to have a TV film.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
67. Kiersten
I don't like Bo's "fix me" problem because it smacks of running away from her conflicts with being Fae rather than learning how to deal with her true nature and there's nothing heroic in that. Thus making her human will be the ultimate cheat. This show is about being Fae, not about being human. Yes, the Fae seriously suck in many ways, but so, as the show has shown, do humans. Fae are special because they're supernatural, nearly immortal, and have been quietly influencing the human world for centuries. Also, it's damn cool to have supernatural powers. In comparison, being human is frequently boring. If Bo was human, there'd be no story to begin with so why the sudden desire to make her human now that there's a way to do it? To me, it feels like many (tho not all) of those in favor of making Bo human are basically just trying to fix one of the fundamental conflicts that's keeping Bo and Doctor Lauren from their happily ever after and keeping Dyson viable for Bo's affections long term. Which is another cop out. Pick one or the other or neither but don't take the choice from Bo by changing the rules of the game because that's cheating. Frankly, ALL the fans deserve better than that.

Evony is, without question, an amoral, evil character. Even without her Fae power, she is true to that characterization, making her one of the very few characters on LG who has any consistency. She's entertaining as hell, but yes, gleefully, unrepentantly evil. I'd say though that she's admirable with her "I'm a survivor" credo. How she survives is horrible, yes, absolutlely, but that she's such a survivor isn't. Which, again, makes her entertaining and fascinating because she knows who she is and doesn't compromise that for anyone or in the face of anything. Bo survives by sucking the chi of other people, Fae and human, with or without their uninfluenced consent, an issue the show continues to skate over. Evony doesn't give a rat's ass about anyone's consent. She does what most benefits her and makes no bones about it. Unfortunately, she's still undeniably evil, but still.

The problem with what Doctor Lauren did to Evony isn't about the fact that it was done to Evony, it's about the fact that DL did it, that she sank so low as to do something arguably as evil as anything Evony has done. The "heroes" or the "good guys" in the story are such because they don't do things like that; no matter how bad the situation, they do not cross the proverbial line. Changing someone's DNA to fundamentally alter the course of their life for good (barring a de-Faeing serum which wasn't mentioned as an option at the time of the offense) is leaping chasms acros the line. Especially when you know it will put the person's life in serious jeopardy with her family/clan/side and you do it anyway.

DL's behavior is not excusable just because it's done to a clearly evil character because the action being done reflects on the person doing it, not the person they're doing it to. Unless they're an antihero and then it's usually because they're doing it to protect the ones they love and/or so the ones they love don't have to compromise themselves by doing questionable things, arguably what Dyson did by killing the hunter to protect Mark but even that was a new character direction for Dyson and the show, for once, took pains to lay that out for the audience first and followed it up with an emotional coda which showed it's immediate effect on Dyson.

Evony was, at the time, no active threat against Bo. In fact, DL was acting on a conversation on which she'd eavesdropped and misunderstood and misinterpreted b/c she didn't stay to hear all of it. Even so, she didn't attack Trick, who was an active part of that conversation too, so that excuse doesn't hold either. If she thought Bo was under real threat due to that overheard conversation, she would have had to find a way to de-Fae Trick too. But she didn't.

Evony's been trying to take Bo out since S1, yes, but Bo has done very well in repeatedly thwarting her, so the assertion that DL "did it for Bo" is ultimately nonsense b/c she more than most people knows how capable Bo is in handling Evony herself AND that Bo does not welcome people doing things on her behalf without her informed consent (or at least, when it's a male person doing things on her behalf without her informed consent. As usual, when DL or does it, it's Twue Lurve).

Worse, in a show that proclaims to be about powerful women, it actively put a woman in the position of stealing another woman's agency and being praised for doing it. There was all this outrage on the image of Dyson shagging Flora in Doctor Lauren's image because it violated DL's agency and identity even though is wasn't actually Doctor Lauren, but it's A-OK when Doctor Lauren does a similar grievance to Evony because she's evil? No. Hell no.

Again, it's not about "Evony is evil so she deserved it". It's about what it means for Doctor Lauren's character to do something that is really, really terrible no matter to whom it's done. This should do something to the "hero's" inner character, as such an action did to Dyson last week, but as per usual when it's DL, instead it's reshaped into a heroic move done out of love rather than what it was, which is essentially the rape of Evony's identity done just because Doctor Lauren could.

Disliking fictional charcters is easy and victimless because they're fiction. People hate Darth Vader, for example, (who did horrible things but ultimately had a redemption story arc) and Voldemort (whom JK Rowling made sympathetic in many ways particularly in his back story), and even the likes of Lydia Bennett in Pride and Prejudice or Katrina in Sleepy Hollow, or Juliette in Grimm, or Laurel in Arrow for various reasons. Is it pointless? Maybe, but whenever fans are invested in a thing, being thwarted in their desires for that thing is going to create discord. Making one character the primary reason for those fans being thwarted in the first place is going to focus that discord on that character, that fictional character, no matter how ridiculous others might deem it.
68. J.Fall
Thank you for that detailed and impartial response. :) Yes, it's always okay for Dyson to eat people on behalf of others very different from anything Lauren selfishly tries to do. Silly me. I'm sure Evony would have preferred that. She, we can note, is still alive, will doubtless try to wreak vengeance and create havoc, evil Dr L.

I don't know why it's suddenly good for Dyson to eat people but I'm sure it has well intentioned wolfy nobility behind it.

Have you ever watched Galaxy Quest, it should be a must see for these sort of forums.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
69. Kiersten
FTR I never said it was OK for Dyson to eat people nor do I think the show has ever presented it as such, though admittedly, it has glossed over it sometimes, like with Taft. I said the show showed how his decision to kill The Hunter was an aberration of character done on the behalf of Mark so that Mark wouldnt learn what it was to kill a man at so young an age and yet would still be protected from the hunter and that he stooped to enlisting Vex's help to do it after raging at and threatening Vex for much of the episode. The show also took pains to show how that decision seriously cost Dyson internally. Doctor Lauren showed no remorse nor any kind of internal cost for what she did to Evony, beyond pride and glee. Also, when Dyson eats people, it's in his wolf form, which is, to an extreme extent, within the nature of a wolf. Though again, that's not an excuse, merely an explanation. The show has also shown this more animalistic, feral side of Dyson to not be something that is unilaterally positive and is something that Dyson does not easily revert to as an option. To my knowledge, it's never been presented as "noble".

I don't think removing another woman's agency is within the nature of Doctor Lauren, though it could be within her character journey if the show chose to present it that way, which it hasn't. I also didn't call Doctor Lauren evil. She can be ambiguous and complex and layered without being outright evil. She's not, because the writers keep putting her in ambiguous situations and doing ambiguous things and then claiming she's actually being heroic. Which is just gutless characterization.

I said what Doctor Lauren did was as evil as anything Evony had ever done, like, say, infecting the others with a parasite that made them revert to teenagers, and yet it had no blow back either on DL's internal character or in the external LG world (because of who she did it to) beyond her life being at risk. Granted, that's significiant, but her life is at risk for creating something that's esssentially weaponized anthrax to the Fae and her actions in creating it are painted as heroic not questionable. Dyson didn't say "you're in danger and you need to protect yourself and seriously (Doctor) Lauren, what the hell were you thinking?" he basically said "you're in danger and you need to take it seriously and protect yourself because people are mad at you and want to use your secret super de-faeing serum for evil, poor dear." As if the existance of the serum itself isn't bad enough in its own right. Which, no.

Galaxy Quest is da bomb.
70. nypinta
I think you completely missed the point Kiersten was making, which was it was not OK that Dyson killed the hunter. And he knows that, he actually acknowledges it on screen and he's feeling like crap about it after. That's the difference. So it's not OK for Dyson to eat people. (Even one that actually did just directly threaten to kill his own son.)
71. nypinta
Or... what Kiersten said. ;)

BTW, I wouldn't see Bo chosing to be human (not that I actually think that's what is going to happen) as a "fix me" thing now since she is OK with being fae. Which would make it ironic that she would chose to be human now that she can handle being fae. Just sayin'.

Besides, we all know Bo's going to track down Ryan to be with him.

Just watched Galaxy Quest again a few weeks ago and BTW the fans that were nitpicking the show saved the day. Not sayin'. Just sayin'.
72. nypinta
I'm repeating myself a lot. WTF is that?
Kiersten Hallie Krum
73. Kiersten
Bo tracking down Ryan in the end would not make me unhappy. He is, to date, the only one (besides Kenzi) who has ever immediately accepted Bo exactly as she is, no judgment, no questions, no demands. Naturally, he had to go. I loved Ryan. I miss Ryan.
74. nypinta
Bo with Ryan. In Spain. Where Kenzi is and she's gotten herself a local hottie. (Someone had to teach her the local lingo...)
Vex opens up a home for wayward fae after learning to not be such a self serving jerk face anymore. Bruce becomes Morrigan. Val (Hale's sister, anyone remember her?) becomes Ash. Stella shows up and makes Trick go with her back to Scotland. He doesn't mind. Dyson is finally introduced to the kick ass warrior fae with all that damn honor and they hit it off. Lauren tries to make herself into a succubus but accidently turns herself into a Valkyrie and she and Tamsin find true love and continue Bo's PI business in faetown. (Bo franchises now. Because Kenzi convices her too. Kenzi never passes up an opportunity.) Who's left? The Norn gets a tree fungus and dies horribly. Aife goes to Hel instead of Bo and she kicks Hades ass and then she takes over.
75. Stacymd2
@kiersten: I adore your posts. STOP writing so much sense!! :-). You said everything I wanted to say, except in a wonderfully eloquent way.

After the Lab incident with Mark, Dyson let The Hunter go. Instead of leaving town post haste, The Hunter tracked Dyson down to confront him in an ally. Dyson knew he would because The Hunter obviously was not interested in ending the violence between Hunters and Shifters. When the Hunter confronted Dyson, he had to have known that only one of them was going to walk away. By his own words, The Hunter said that he was going to kill Dyson then Mark. That was all Dyson needed to hear.

I would have prefered that Dyson fought the Hunter without Vex, but it was more chilling the way the scene played out.

No one on this site has ever said Evony was not evil. By focusing the conversation on Evony, it deflects from Dr. Wonder Lauren's amoral actions. She created a toxin that can wipe out an ancient race, used medical science unethically, administered her toxin in a sexually demeaning manner, humiliated and smacked around her subject, destroyed their live and continues to blackmail her subject for her own benefit.

What does Bo keeping her "humanity" really mean? Lost Girl has shown both good and bad Fae. Bo does not have to be connected to Dr. Vag Serum to be a good, kind person. She can be Fae and help people in need, fight for her human and Fae communities, and protect her loved ones.

When Trick, Tamsin, Dyson and Vex helped to defeat the big bads in S2 & 4, it was to save the whole world, not just the Fae.

This is were Kenzi's presence is greatly missed. What does it say about Bo that the symbol of her humanity is a Terrorist running from justice?
76. Stacymd2
The Fae are no more selfish than the human world they live in.

Bo's succubus is more than her biology. The reason why B/L broke up was not solely because of her feeding. Her feeding was a small part of the reason why Wonder Lauren ended their relationship.

I will have to agree to politely disagree with the above posters who didn't like KHR's performance. He did an excellent job in 504. It was fun seeing him portray Dyson's many emotions. Ones we have not really seen before. So many, many feels! The ONLY time I have seen criticisms of KHR's acting and looks are after episodes where Team Badass gets closer. This is suspicious and telling to me.

I agree that not much can be presumed about Team Badass's future from Bo's attraction to Mark. I maintain that if Mark were Wonder Lauren's long lost little brother there would be numerous posts predicting that B/L was end game and this was proof of their love.

So, tell me what you thought the Vagina necklace meant?

I also think some are project Wonder Lauren's dream for her future onto Bo. Dr. Wonder Terrorist M.D. has baby names picked out. Everyone intemperates Lost Girl's storylines differently. I think Bo does not want a "normal" human life with a 9 to 5, mortgage & 2.5 kids. Bo wanted the option. If that is what she really wanted then why start a paranormal detective agency? Each case took her deeper into the Fae world.

Bo dived head first into the Fae world because she wanted to be Fae. After 10 years of killing and running she found a true home, friends and a community where she belonged. It is like a LGBTQ Person accepting who they are, comes out and gets involved in the community by going to gay clubs, joining LGBTQ groups and immersing themselves in the culture.

Bo returning back to the human closet is not an option. I agree that it would regress the character. With that said, after season 4 anything is possible.
77. Stacymd2
Final thought until next week...

IMHO, in 101, when Bo chose humans she did so because she was rebelling against being forced into a situation that she was afraid of, didn't understand yet and was really choosing Kenzi.

I hope the powers that be bring back Hale in a flash back. The season can't end without some sexy siren abs.

I hope we get to see Dyson and Mark's relationship develop. I don't want another shadow thief waste of time.

The crazy blonde lawyer is still very interesting. I'm crossing all fingers and toes that she doesn't turn into another Rainer or wet noodle Una Mens storyline.

I like the spec that Blonde Lawyer could be Demeter and the spec that Hades took over her body. The Fae cult story arc could be interesting.

I hope all of you had a wonderful New Years. May 2015 bring us happiness, love and success.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
78. Kiersten
I honestly think, and I believe I've seen this mentioned elsewhere, that Bo wearing the vagina necklace was more product placement than any intended confirmation of Bo and Doctor Lauren's relationship. She wore it in the two-part premiere and it was even called out by the doc as a gift but nothing more, and then Bo wore it again in the beginning of E3 but she hasnt worn it since. Bo typically doesnt wear jewelry b/c it would block her cleavage. So yeah, I'm leaning toward product placement & giving those fans who bought it the chance to see Bo wearing it again on screen a few times unless & until the show says otherwise.
79. nypinta
When I initially made the comment about Bo choosing to become human but then leaving everyone to go live with Kenzi it was in jest. However, it isn't outside the realm of possibility and I wouldn't see it as her returning to any closet. (It might be a cop out though because they'd side step her choosing between Dyson and Lauren, but honestly the show is not about the damn triangle even if it has taken up so much time, thanks to TPTB that can't just commit to a storyline.) But Bo accepting being fae doesn't mean that she wouldn't willingly give it up to prevent someone else from using her, which seems to be what they are saying Hades wants to do. I do agree that Bo probably chose human at first just to thumb her nose at the Light and Dark since all she knew of them at the time was they abducted her, subjected her to invasive tests, and then bullied her into making a choice where as Kenzi, a human, accepted her immediately and was the only one that really put herself on the line to help her. It was more reaction than any real statement. Because they seemed to drop Bo's chosing humans as a clan as early as the middle of season 1. Then she was the champion of the fae (even if she wouldn't accept the title itself) in season 2 and in season 3 it was fae vs humans, which continued in season 4. But Bo has already decided that being the "chosen one" is all hype and bullshit and if the thing standing between her and a life she wants is her faeness, I can see her walking away from it. Being fae is what she is, not who she is. And sometimes giving up power is the most heroic thing a person can do. And I have no idea of Bo wants the little house with the pickett fence or not. She seems to at times. When she met Luann she fought so hard for her because Luann had that and it was taken from her by the fae for what Bo considers arbitrary rules. She enjoyed the fantasy of it with Dyson in season one when they were playing husband and wife and in her Dawning ceremony she built that kind of life for herself in her delusion. The only difference that Dyson made was to take Lauren's place as the doctor and Lauren then became him as a cop. Even in this last episode Bo seems whistful at the idea that she and Dyson would settle down and be the ones to have kids. Is it a part of her ubringing that she should want these things or is it Bo herself that wants them, who knows. She really hasn't had a chance to even consider that as an option since she killed her boyfriend when she was 18. It was a life that suddenly became impossible. And it was because she was fae that she hasn't had time to decide what she really wants. Everyone else has had the chance to walk away from the fae to find out what they wanted, except Bo. Trick gave up power as a King to found the new fae colony. Dyson walked away from his pack and wandered as a lone wolf before realizing what he really wanted was to serve a good fae King (and later Queen) and be the protector he just is, Lauren left to work with Taft and again left all the fae before she decided she wanted to go back, (but got nabbed by Evony along the way anyhow), and now Kenzi has left to find herself away from the fae. It might just finally be Bo's turn.
80. DeannaC
Hi guys, I am a lurker I apologize for creeping. I am mostly a lurker because I watched the show on Netflix over the summer and fell in love with the first season. Then after that it just cascaded into darkness. I have no idea what happened. I remember watching the first episode which was Hella fun and entertaining, so I looked online to see what others thought about it. I thought I would love Lauren because she was EVERYWHERE, but she sucks...I did love the interactions between Bo and Kenzi, Kenzi and Dyson, and Dyson and Bo. I liked Trick and Evony is hilarious, oh and of course Vex I mean who in their right mind would not adore Vex. I also loved the Fae world and the introduction to it was solid. I can't even remember the last three season except for the invasion of Doccubus, which was one of the worst written romances I had ever seen. I understood it was going to happen in the first season but man I did not expect it to play out like that. Which was BOOOORING. I think it's sad that I don't even like Bo or want to talk about Bo because she was so awesome and badass in the first season.
Anyway this last episode felt like the first season, but only in parts I suspect that has to do with Kenzi's abscence. I miss K.S. like crazy, Kenzi was the only consistent part of the show besides the whole Hale love fiascco. I did appreciate Dyson's character getting attention but he hasn't gotten anything good for a long time, which is sad because that character so deserved better. I wasn't the biggest fan of the kid though I thought he was fairly boring and one dimensial. I am curious how this story line plays out though. I have no idea how the story will end now that we know Bo's dad is Hades. I'm sure they will delay it so that the ships can sail for awhile then rush the ending. I figured this episode would be based around Valkubus and it was. I think that pairing is out of nowhere but whatever. I would love it if they could get me to love Bo for Bo again and not just make her Lauren's girlfriend or Tamsin's love interest. Can she be the center again, enough with the shipping otay?
Kiersten Hallie Krum
81. Kiersten
@nypinta Bo wasn't wistful for family and kids with Dyson last episode. That wasnt referred to at all & I dont think Mark as a topic was enough to make that link si ce he's not a child. She was wistful for the relationship she once thought she was going to have with Dyson, when she believed they would be each other's forever back in S1 and of course that version of their relationship was destroyed by the Norn (Freaking Norn!)

Welcome Deanna! Glad you came out of lurkdom! Totally agree with you about S1 etc. Really feels like we were cheared out of a great show, doesnt it? And yes, KS's absence is deeply felt on the show for sure.
82. nypinta
I say that Bo was wistful about her and Dyson having kids and the whole kit and kaboodle because it was directly after she and Tamsin were talking about Mark as Dyson's son. I do think that once upon a time Bo had a fantasy that she and Dyson would settle down and have kids and be married and "normal". But that was ages ago. Too much has changed now. She might not even be sure she wants that now.

So.... no one? No one has anything to say about the last episode? Because holy moly!

*SPOILERS* for the next episode.

I know there is a lot of negative online reaction, but that's just surface stuff. (Which is ironic since a lot of people are calling the show shallow, when their complaints are about the shallow stuff...) (I could have worded that better.) But Bo has finally admitted what she has probably been trying to avoid recognizing, and that she was born with someone else's purpose in mind. And it's NOT good. Up until that moment that she walked into the room where she was born Bo had the luxury of thinking anything else about her origin but now has to fully and finally confront that fact that someone made her and that all those years on the run where she kept killing anyone she let close to her might be the "good old day" very soon. But in the same breath as she confesses it Tamsin tells her exactly what she needs to hear: that she can fight it. Which Bo would do anyhow, but Tamsin is an example that it can be done. Both are "created weapons" that came into their own and fought back against their "creator" to live their own lives.

And not only that, but the big bad is hella creepy with the preplanning. I mean, the only thing I can figure about what Horatio was doing (or being used to do) was find all of the oracles, any of the fae that could reveal their plan, and dispatch them. That's very forward thinking. And cruel. Do we finally have a villain worthy of the hype? Oh please oh please.

As for the comedy in the show: seems people are annoyed at how Lauren was depicted, but I think they're forgetting it was for a reason. Her luck was being sapped by the cat. In the mean time Bo is lapping up drinks and purring and napping in boxes! Sure it's not cake in the face, but Lauren wasn't the only one looking slightly foolish in the episode. Nice couterpoint to Cassie's situation. I'd say a little levity was necessary.

I know Mark is annoying and a stupid kid, but honestly I think that is his point right now. They need a weak link because if anyone else had let someone into Trick's lair it wouldn't have been as believable. I suspect that Vex was in on it. But I'm not 100% on that. I missed a lot because my lap top kept freezing and when I swtiched to another feed *someone* kept screaming at the screen so everyone else couldn't hear a thing. Which, it's great that someone makes the show visible, but STFU so people can hear.
Kiersten Hallie Krum
83. Kiersten
The new spoiler post just went live. I do have an editor and it does take a few hours into the next day for everyone to get the ducks in a row.

New discussion post for episode 5 here:
84. nypinta
I'm not saying I was here for a few hours refreshing so I'd see the new recap when it came up but... and I finally gave in and posted just as you were.
85. Thelwastofyourproblems
That's what i like about bo and dyson's relationship, There love is understood, not always prounouced or delcared. They know that they love eachother, we know they love eachother EVERYBODY knows that they love eachother. When Dyson says i love you, you can see bo's face melt everytime as if he's said it for the first time. They have a great solid relationship and it ASHAME! that it is not being given the recognition it deserves because people want to see two women making whoopie together!
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